Ryan Wells
05-26-2008, 09:48 AM
I have heard words of wisdom and tips on lifting for years from my dad, who was a pretty serious powerlifter in the late 60's/early 70's. He would often talk about this Bill West and his buddy George Frenn. I had no idea until I put two and two together and called him again this morning that he was referring to Bill "Peanuts" West of the "original Westside Barbell" in Culver City, Ca.
My dad did what any serious lifter did back then, you went to California and trained with and talked with who was known to be the innovators. This was back before Internet and all of that. He told me that in 1968, right before he left for Vietnam, him and his buddy went to train at the original Gold's Gym in Venice Beach. There they met Joe Gold, who by the way came up with benches and apparatuses that are considered staples in gyms to this day. (As an aside, Joe Gold soon sold his name and opened up World's Gym). My dad said he went out there to hook up with Bill West and George Frenn. He got Bill's phone number from Joe Gold.
He told me about how they worked out in Bill's garage. Bill was a powerlifter in the 198's and George Frenn was 242's. George not only squatted over 800, benched over 500, and deadlifted over 800, he was an Olympic hammer thrower. My dad said that at this time, Bill was known to be a little older than the rest of the guys and had a lot of injuries and surgeries already, but still was regularly squatting and pulling over 600.
He said that he stayed with them and worked out with them for a couple of weeks. He told me how George would come out to the garage and following a warm up, "bounce 700 lbs up and down for several reps" (referring to the squat).
I asked my dad if he realized that this is where box squatting and much of what Louie Simmons does came from. He asked me who Louie was and I explained. He said all of that came much later, but yes, that is where box squatting came from (and possibly even the where the Westside template evolved from).
I asked about what routine or split (template) they followed. He said that they all followed the same routine that was referred to as "push/pull". They would organize all of there push movements on one day and all of there pull the other He said that it was broken down like this:
Mon: Push
Tues: Pull
Thur: Push
Fri: Pull
They did heavy "bench squat" on Monday. This is where they would squat to a weight bench (about 17"). I believe this to be what Louie calls the high box. The second push day, my dad said that they would squat to a milk crate and work on "being explosive with lower weight". I take it that this is what Louie referees to DE day on a low box. He said they would flat bench press on one push day and do incline bench and seated overhead on the other push day. This is very similar to how Pat Casey (the first man to bench 600 and also worked out regularly at Bill West's garage) split up his bench days. He said they stated that this was the best routine as long as you didn't get too sore and didn't have an injury.
He said that while he was out there, there was a group of Olympic shot putters that were working out there. He said that they were more interested in the incline benching on a steep incline. He said that they felt this mimicked the shot put angle the best. My dad stressed that this was when the Americans were getting 1st, 2nd, and 3rd in the shot put. He talked about one shot putter that worked out there that had a 470 incline bench and a "3 something behind the neck press", but he couldn't remember the athletes name of the top of his head.
I asked about their set/reps. I asked if they maxed all of the time. He said "no way." He said they preached about learning your body. He stated that they would max out with singles no more than once a month. They understood that any more would lead to "perpetual soreness" as they called it. So I asked what they did the other time, He said they would always warm up the same with sets of 8-10 and then as the weight went up the reps got lower. He said that some days they would hit a heavy set of 5 and on other days they would hit a heavy triple. It was based on how they felt. He said that on one push day, George Frenn squatted 700 on the bench for a set of 8.
I told my dad that after all these years I didn't realize who he was referring to until late last night. I asked if he understood how important that garage gym was to powerlifting and how it is still talked about to this day. He just nonchalantly replied that it was just known as a little hub for some of the strongest guys at that time. He said it was a small garage with less equipment than I currently have. I asked if he squatted with them. He said "no". He was a 400+ bench presser back them. He said that he would work in on the bench sessions, but just watch and ask questions on the squat and DL sessions. He said that when he returned to Michigan that a lot of the serious lifters were starting to follow that same push/pull template.
I was reluctant to post this, but I figured some of you out there may be interested. I would like to get my dad on here, but he is 63 years old and I don’t think he knows how to even turn a computer on. I’m going to try to pick his brain some more in the coming weeks.
Edit: I DID ask if the just touched the box or sat on it. He said that they would sit on it and rock forward off of the box.
My dad did what any serious lifter did back then, you went to California and trained with and talked with who was known to be the innovators. This was back before Internet and all of that. He told me that in 1968, right before he left for Vietnam, him and his buddy went to train at the original Gold's Gym in Venice Beach. There they met Joe Gold, who by the way came up with benches and apparatuses that are considered staples in gyms to this day. (As an aside, Joe Gold soon sold his name and opened up World's Gym). My dad said he went out there to hook up with Bill West and George Frenn. He got Bill's phone number from Joe Gold.
He told me about how they worked out in Bill's garage. Bill was a powerlifter in the 198's and George Frenn was 242's. George not only squatted over 800, benched over 500, and deadlifted over 800, he was an Olympic hammer thrower. My dad said that at this time, Bill was known to be a little older than the rest of the guys and had a lot of injuries and surgeries already, but still was regularly squatting and pulling over 600.
He said that he stayed with them and worked out with them for a couple of weeks. He told me how George would come out to the garage and following a warm up, "bounce 700 lbs up and down for several reps" (referring to the squat).
I asked my dad if he realized that this is where box squatting and much of what Louie Simmons does came from. He asked me who Louie was and I explained. He said all of that came much later, but yes, that is where box squatting came from (and possibly even the where the Westside template evolved from).
I asked about what routine or split (template) they followed. He said that they all followed the same routine that was referred to as "push/pull". They would organize all of there push movements on one day and all of there pull the other He said that it was broken down like this:
Mon: Push
Tues: Pull
Thur: Push
Fri: Pull
They did heavy "bench squat" on Monday. This is where they would squat to a weight bench (about 17"). I believe this to be what Louie calls the high box. The second push day, my dad said that they would squat to a milk crate and work on "being explosive with lower weight". I take it that this is what Louie referees to DE day on a low box. He said they would flat bench press on one push day and do incline bench and seated overhead on the other push day. This is very similar to how Pat Casey (the first man to bench 600 and also worked out regularly at Bill West's garage) split up his bench days. He said they stated that this was the best routine as long as you didn't get too sore and didn't have an injury.
He said that while he was out there, there was a group of Olympic shot putters that were working out there. He said that they were more interested in the incline benching on a steep incline. He said that they felt this mimicked the shot put angle the best. My dad stressed that this was when the Americans were getting 1st, 2nd, and 3rd in the shot put. He talked about one shot putter that worked out there that had a 470 incline bench and a "3 something behind the neck press", but he couldn't remember the athletes name of the top of his head.
I asked about their set/reps. I asked if they maxed all of the time. He said "no way." He said they preached about learning your body. He stated that they would max out with singles no more than once a month. They understood that any more would lead to "perpetual soreness" as they called it. So I asked what they did the other time, He said they would always warm up the same with sets of 8-10 and then as the weight went up the reps got lower. He said that some days they would hit a heavy set of 5 and on other days they would hit a heavy triple. It was based on how they felt. He said that on one push day, George Frenn squatted 700 on the bench for a set of 8.
I told my dad that after all these years I didn't realize who he was referring to until late last night. I asked if he understood how important that garage gym was to powerlifting and how it is still talked about to this day. He just nonchalantly replied that it was just known as a little hub for some of the strongest guys at that time. He said it was a small garage with less equipment than I currently have. I asked if he squatted with them. He said "no". He was a 400+ bench presser back them. He said that he would work in on the bench sessions, but just watch and ask questions on the squat and DL sessions. He said that when he returned to Michigan that a lot of the serious lifters were starting to follow that same push/pull template.
I was reluctant to post this, but I figured some of you out there may be interested. I would like to get my dad on here, but he is 63 years old and I don’t think he knows how to even turn a computer on. I’m going to try to pick his brain some more in the coming weeks.
Edit: I DID ask if the just touched the box or sat on it. He said that they would sit on it and rock forward off of the box.