Being athletic as a strongman

[Arnell Castillo]

so I was wondering how most of you feel about being more of an all around athlete when competing in strongman as oppose to not . do you guys think it's more benefitial in the long run ? I've changed my whole workout philosophy to become more athletic and it's been paying . My thursday workouts are my conditioning,plyo,core work day . I've found that the more I train like an athlete the better i'm getting at the strongman stuff .

[dcarroll]

Arnel, I think most would agree athleticism is very important in doing well in strongman, however I also think you need to be strong.

[Jay Hagadorn]

I agree with Doug! You must have good core strength levels at the base of your athleticism to do well...

[Arnell Castillo]

Arnel, I think most would agree athleticism is very important in doing well in strongman, however I also think you need to be strong.

yea yea being strong is a given or it wouldn't be strongman . LOL... I was just wondering what was the thought about it . I know there are a few guys who don't like to do the extra cardio work as far as the runnng/sprinting/stairs/plyometrics/core work and stuff like that . and would prefer to do sled drags and stuff of that nature to get in cardio shape .

[Jay Hagadorn]

I know there are a few guys who don't like to do the extra cardio work as far as the runnng/sprinting/stairs/plyometrics/core work and stuff like that . and would prefer to do sled drags and stuff of that nature to get in cardio shape .

Most of my cardio is "lighter" event training. I haven't been able to do running/sprinting/stairs/plyometrics etc...too much because my weight has been up around 320lbs. I can do it, I just end up paying LOL...

The fact that I have chosen not to do it does not mean I am not athletic (I ran a 4.9 40yd several months back w/out warming up on grass.) I think most competitors don't typically train like that because of the added weight and being careful w/ the joints.

I am dropping weight right now so I can chase my kids w/out paying too badly LOL :LOL:

[rjpe99]

I am definitely not the athlete I was when I first started strongman. I ran track for 2 years and played baseball for two years in college. At that time my Cardio was very much better as well as my agility and speed. I still feel like my cardio and speed are good. Still they are not close to what they were 4 years ago but I am a much better strongman competitor.

After I stop competing in strongman I plan on droping weight to the 210-220 range because I miss being able to run severeal miles without endurance becoming a factor.

[Matt Brouse]

Arnell, since you decided to cut some weight several months back your training has been getting better and better.

Athleticism is a necessity for most of us. Keep up the good work.

[David Paaluhi]

I agree that strongmen should also be athletic. Strongman competitions is not about just being strong. You need muscle strength, muscle endurance, and cardiovascular endurance. I think incorporating sprints, speed work, explosion, core, injury prevention excercises, and stretching are a great way to become athletic along with your usual strength training.

I have just finished my first year of football at Oregon State and we do alot of conditioning, core, speed training, and strength training year around. I have increased my strength and overall athleticism greatly.

[Arnell Castillo]

Most of my cardio is "lighter" event training. I haven't been able to do running/sprinting/stairs/plyometrics etc...too much because my weight has been up around 320lbs. I can do it, I just end up paying LOL...

The fact that I have chosen not to do it does not mean I am not athletic (I ran a 4.9 40yd several months back w/out warming up on grass.) I think most competitors don't typically train like that because of the added weight and being careful w/ the joints.

I am dropping weight right now so I can chase my kids w/out paying too badly LOL :LOL:

lol.. nah Jay i'm not saying that you're not athletic at all . not even close to saying that . I guess i've been on this personal mission to become better at what I do and it's the only way I know how too . i've been feeling alot better physically and mentally . and what the heck a 4.9 40 ??? that is freakin awesome and I would say that is pretty athletic for a big man to running a 4.9 forty . lol.... my best time was a 5.2 . lol...

[Mike Pelosi]

I've seen plenty of athletic people do good when they first start training...some go on further, some stay in the mid pack of local shows consistently. It's simply not enough.

But, I could care less how athletic someone is...you don't have to be athletic to be strong. Furthermore, strength is a part of athleticism. Explosiveness is a part of athleticism. And, thats about where the buck stops with strongman.

I exclude conditioning because the level that is needed is not nearly as high as some people think.

You can't be good in strongman or even compete at a certain basic level and not have some athleticism simply because the movements you are training are all ATHLETIC movements. And it's not an overly athletic sport. Theirs very little change of direction, very little reaction timing, multi-plane movements, decelerating etc

However, being athletic doesn't hurt either. A 4.5 40 time does not translate over into strongman at all, unless you are strong. A 50" box jump has no correlation to your yoke walk. I'd rather take a 400 log press then being able to get faster sprinting in a straight line.

[Matthew White]

Personally I think a healthy body and good athletic conditioning should be the base for any strongman! Sometimes its difficult to not lose sight of this for the gain of more strength.

[Patrick McGuffin]

Sometimes its difficult to not lose sight of this for the gain of more strength.

Me in a nutshell.

[Ashley Christopher Moore]

I am all for being a great athlete. I played sports most of my life. However,I for one am sick of seing contest where the more athletic guy wins. Why are we doing medly and cardio events. I thought we were trying to find out who is the strongest not the fastest.
Yeah,I know it's more crowd pleasing BLAH BLAH BLAH

If you want to be an athelete go to the olympics
if you want to be strong lift heavy

[jeromy moore]

I believe being a better athlete you can make easier and faster strength gains.

[Ryan Bracewell]

I would say it is obvious from watching the top pros that athleticism is crucial. You need a certain amount of strength, but the guy with agility and speed will win every time if they are close to equal strength.

[Kevin Cronin]

I would say it is obvious from watching the top pros that athleticism is crucial. You need a certain amount of strength, but the guy with agility and speed will win every time if they are close to equal strength.
That's like saying the guy with strength will win every time if they are close to equal agility and speed.

[D.J. Satterfield]

If you want to be an athelete go to the olympics
if you want to be strong lift heavy

With this training of thought, you would want to finish your second line with "if you want to be strong, then powerlift"

Arnell,
I think you are on the right track. Being in shape and strong are the ultimate keys to me.
If you can move but have no strength, that is not good. If you have strength and can't move, that is not good.
Together, you have something great. That is what strongman is, the combination of both.

[Ryan Bracewell]

you could look at it that way too. Basically I am saying that athleticism(agility & speed) will help you utilize your strength in a more effective way.

[jeromy moore]

DJ hit the nail on the head. Many of us have seen good athletes get burried by heavy weights and on the flip side we have seen many powerlifters struggle with moving events.

[Arnell Castillo]

Arnell,
I think you are on the right track. Being in shape and strong are the ultimate keys to me.
If you can move but have no strength, that is not good. If you have strength and can't move, that is not good.
Together, you have something great. That is what strongman is, the combination of both.

Yea i'm working on being both strong and athletic and in super cardiovacular shape . It just works better for me personaly . i've seen a huge difference in my tarining because of it . my strength has gone up and i'm not as tired because of extra stuff i've added on to my program .

[Patrick McGuffin]

Yea i'm working on being both strong and athletic and in super cardiovacular shape . It just works better for me personaly . i've seen a huge difference in my tarining because of it . my strength has gone up and i'm not as tired because of extra stuff i've added on to my program .


Anybody who says differently is probably lying to themselves to justify not doing conditioning... like me.

[Ashley Christopher Moore]

DJ,I like all weightlifting including oly,powerlifting and strongman also body building,highland games and others. I think that lately the competions are getting BETTER(heavier) but have a long was to go if we truly want to find out who is the srongest man in the world not the "Worlds Strongest Man" I think that many people choose and like this sport because they think it will be easier to do than powerlifting if they are atheletic and can win when they can not win in powerlifting. I believe that strongman is a better test of overall strength than powerlifting or any other strength sport because it test nearly every muslce in the body aand most of the time simetanously. However I think the sport went wrong early on with the reps and running part it would be better if we just maxed out on everything stones,log press,dead,Heavy Heavy farmers for very short distances and even st.bar curl you are only as strong as your weakest link why would you want to have strong shoulders but not arms(some strength sports) strong arms but no deadlift(some body builders)I know that this kind of lifting is not as crowd pleasing but who are we doing this for the crowd or ourselves If "The Worlds Strongest Man Contest" was truly for the strongest man in the world then why a different winner at different competitions and some times a different winner every other year especially when they are not stronger but simply put the stone in the hole 1st or didn't stumble on the way to the platform. Don't get me wrong,I love strongman. I like where it is headed NOW! But even still, SOME of the competions out there seem more like slighty heavier versions of Crossfit. Why run a marathon to see who is the fastest man in the world. Also,the title Strongman is misleading in my opinion and is probably offensive to some others ou there. Every one wants to be known as the strongest man in the world, Powerlifters,Strongmen,Olympic Weight Lifters,and even some Bodybuilders. How could you truly label yourself the strongest man in the world if you don't test maximum strength in competition(Strongman), don't exibit all around strength in every muscle(Powerlifting), or exibit brute strength instead of lifts that are more based on explosiveness,athletisism and technique(Olympic Weightlifting.) All of these sports have very strong men and women but there is only one real way to test maximum strength and see who is the strongest and it doesn't involve being Michael Jordan or running a 40 with dumbells in each hand

I truly hope this does not offend anyone, that was not the intention of this post. My intention was to explain a previous post in this thread and to hoprfully get people thinking about what real all around strength is. I am a big fan of Big Z and would like to see him beat Pudzianowski in the Arnold Classic(if Pudzianowski ever competes there again) The Arnold is the closest(in my opinion) to the truiest test of strength we have gotten so far. Fortismus wasn't bad either.

[Dan Eberhardt]

Honestly, I like the athletic side of it. I'm not a fan of power lifting, I find it boring. Both training for it and watching it. With strongman (in its current WSM format) you get to lift heavy weights, but you also have to be quick about it.

Something consider is how do you define strength. With what we are seeing at the moment you need strong muscles, but also strong endurance and a strong mind to push yourself through the competition. You can't test just one of those aspects and claim to be the strongest in the world.

Also, what I find quite interesting is that over the years the weights have gone up yet strongmen are getting faster and faster. Does this not count for something? You have to consider that the weights being moved ARE heavy, just what we (as strongmen and enthusiasts thereof) see as heavy is something completely different to what others might see as heavy. For example, I cannot deadlift 300kg but I think of a 300kg deadlift as fairly light because what I see strongmen doing is around the 400kg mark.

There still seems to be quite a few max strength/last man standing events thrown into strongman, usually a deadlift contest. Maybe I've missed something and they have been taken out.

I'm interested to know how you'd set up a competition to test who the worlds strongest man REALLY is. What sort of events would you have in it?

[Ashley Christopher Moore]

Dan,I would have all the same events but change them to one rep events only. As for the Medley,I would take it out. Farmers walk I would make about 100lb. heavier each hand, the furthest distance wins(thick handles only.) The same goes for all the carrying events such as the Hussafeld Stone. I would also add in Bench,Squat,Military,St.Bar Curl ect.

I like strongman the way it is and the way it started. I am a fan of all of the old time strongmen and all of the previous. This to me though would just make it clear who is the best not the most athletic.

Again,I hope this does not offend anyone.
I love all weightlifting.
Chris

[Derek Poundstone]

Dan,I would have all the same events but change them to one rep events only. As for the Medley,I would take it out. Farmers walk I would make about 100lb. heavier each hand, the furthest distance wins(thick handles only.) The same goes for all the carrying events such as the Hussafeld Stone. I would also add in Bench,Squat,Military,St.Bar Curl ect.

I like strongman the way it is and the way it started. I am a fan of all of the old time strongmen and all of the previous. This to me though would just make it clear who is the best not the most athletic.

Again,I hope this does not offend anyone.
I love all weightlifting.
Chris
Chris, what will we do when Military press and curling shirts come out. Do you ban all lifting suits, shirts or equipment in general? A PL will win this type of contest hands down! Think about it. The best PL guys are getting very close to a 3000 lb total. The best squat is in the 1200 lb range, the best DL is just over 1000 lbs and the best bench is now around 1030 lbs. Strongman wont make up enough ground in the military press or curl to even get close to a total of these number even if you add in the military press and curl. Also, right now the top contest have farmers that weight 350 - 400 lbs. Being liberal and going with with an average of a 350 lbs farmers and bumping up to 450 lbs farmers per hand, most of the best guys in the world will struggle to go only a few feet making this a event of millimeters when you are complaining about a little thing such as getting a stone in a hole. If the best football team cant help but be offsides and commit pass interference penalties, they will never win a division championship, yet alone a superbowl. If the best baseball team cant catch a flyball on a sunny day, have a good pitcher or be able to run the bases quickly, they will never get even close to the World Series! I can keep going on with this if my point isn't received. What you are basically describing is a home run dearby instead of a baseball game or quarterbacks passing for distance instead of playing the beautiful game of football. The little nuiances of the sport are what make if great. You most control the weight in strongman as with any weightlifting sport! Finally, you dont have have different champions every other year and the best in the world dont lose very often as you seem to suggest. How many times has Big Z and Mariusz lost in competition? Define loosing. Is second or third losing? Both of these men have the winningest records ever in strongman and are both considered the strogest men in the world. A contest such as you are describing will have a vastly different winner at every contest and will never have a chance to grow as no one will want to watch such a contest! If no one watches the sport and very little compete due to this, then the title will be just that, a titles with no credence!!

I also have to comment on the fact that you seem to think us top Pro's are running around with weights at your average competitions. Yes, some of the best in the world make it look easy but have you average gym rat try and pick up a 1000 lb yoke, a 400 lb stone, a 400 lb log etc... In you average SM contest there is always several guys in each even that struggle with the given weights! What you are describing for a competition is what Dione puts on every year called "The Record Breakers". A contest were all the best Strongman get together for a comp and lift the heaviest weights possible. This type of contest if fun, but not the best example of what strongman are capable of. In the past, you could throw a great football lineman or PLer into a top SM contest and they would be a threat (remember the very eary WSM contests). Now days, I know for an absolute fact no other professional athlete will even come close to the best of us in just a training day! I dont care if its a world class olympuic lifter that crushes the axle, maybe a log becasue we'll have revenge on every other SM event or a world class PLer or a 350+ lb football Offensive lineman that will hold there own in the big three lifts cause us strongmen will have the yoke, farmers, stones, log etc.. to make up the difference. We as strongman are just that, BRUTALLY STRONG! This is why I can go on network TV and roll a frying pan into a burrito with out ever trying before! I've done may Publicity stunts such as this in the past few months and have learned that the way we train with repetitions, and the events we do, truely makes up the strongest men and women in the world!! Powerlifters are the most powerful, strongmen are the strongest!

Sorry for ranting, it just seems to be in my nature! I'm very passionate about this sport and want it to succeed as a main stream sport.

[Dan Eberhardt]

Well said Derek.

ahaha, curling shirts. If those ever get made you can forget using a squat rack, EVER.

[Ashley Christopher Moore]

Well said Derek! It is nice to have input from a professional stand point. I want to see you and all other strongmen succeed. It would be nice if our sport went main stream. Allthough if someone truly loves it I believe they would do it even if no one new about it and still had to work 40 hours a week. The main thing I was trying to get across is that I would rather see the strongest guy win instead of the most athletic. This is just my opinion and I know it probably doesn't matter to a pro but I thought that was part of what this forum was about.

I am sorry if I ticked you off
I am a fan of yours and wish you all the best
Chris

[Chris Dwyer]

The athletic part of strongman is what really draws me to the sport. I love the idea of "pick this up and put it over there as many times as you can". It tests not only your strength, but also your mental toughness and your heart. Things like truck pulls, medleys, and max rep events really require you to push your limits. I'm not saying that max events don't. But, in my opinion, it is a lot easier to get and stay motivated for a 1RM than it is to stay motivated 45 seconds into a 1 minute DL, squat, press, or anything for max reps in a minute.

I think that a good contest has a mix of many things - heavy or max lifts; lifts for reps; and medleys of some sort. This requires people to be well rounded, in shape, and strong.

[Ashley Christopher Moore]

good point

[Steve Trippe]

Chris,

My problem with the "1 rm everything" arguement is that it's simply not practical. A 1rm stone? Stones aren't loadable, and having a 575 and a 580 is just not going to happen. Also, no one wants to do a 1rm stone (except Travis).

What about farmers? Do we set a 10ft distance and have multiple runs increasing in weight till no one is left? What if on a heavy attempt your hand slips, even though you are capable of doing the weight?

Is it really applicable to have a plate loadable tire? I don't think so. I don't think this would be a goo event. I can completely miss a tire, walk away, come back, and hit 3 reps on that same tire sometimes. Not to mention, tires are so different, competitors would have no idea what weight to call for on a particular tire.

Personally, I think strongman is just that. It shows what a strong man would be capable of, not what someone that is technically proficient and wears the most gear is capable of. I think that doing a 5rm (if you only get 5 reps on a max reps event) is just as applicable to strength as doing a 1rm.





Also, stop kissing up. You didn't say anything offensive, you are just stating your opinion (as am I) in an well moderated debate. I know you are new to the board, but from what I have seen you have a lot to contribute, so contribute, and don't worry about offending people with your personal views (within forum rules).

"This is just my opinion and I know it probably doesn't matter to a pro but I thought that was part of what this forum was about."

This is exactly what this forum is. I don't think Derek really was taking any of it personally, he was just venting his counterargument. Just because he is a pro doesn't mean he isn't still a brother in iron, and he's still a very down to earth guy from everything I've seen. If he really was taking it personally, then he'd start a thread about it, I'd call him out for being sensitive, others would agree and tell him he has nothing to worry about, and Jono would post a funny picture somewhere.

My point is, Jesse wanted this forum to be a place where all types of strongman competitors could converse, and especially with the pro's. Just follow the board rules and continue to voice your opinion.

[D.J. Satterfield]

Ashley,
I understand where you are coming from and can see your point, I just don't agree with it.
You can't just have all max. effort events or it is just a variety of a PL meet. Even back in the day, they had athleticism in strongman, ie: pulling trucks, log reps, keg loads, etc.
I do agree though, when amateur shows are moving more weight than pro shows, that is not the answer either.

I would agree too, there needs to be a good mix of max. effort and moving events.

[Ashley Christopher Moore]

Thanks everyone for chimming in.
DJ and Steve I think I understand what you are saying,you have some good points.

[Derek Poundstone]

Well said Derek! It is nice to have input from a professional stand point. I want to see you and all other strongmen succeed. It would be nice if our sport went main stream. Allthough if someone truly loves it I believe they would do it even if no one new about it and still had to work 40 hours a week. The main thing I was trying to get across is that I would rather see the strongest guy win instead of the most athletic. This is just my opinion and I know it probably doesn't matter to a pro but I thought that was part of what this forum was about.

I am sorry if I ticked you off
I am a fan of yours and wish you all the best
Chris
As Steve said, you weren't offending me at all. One thing I think most people on this forum know about me is I am very passionate and tend to go on little rants here and there. Your post inspired something in me to sit down and write my thoughts (I was in the middle of my Fortissimus.MSG write-up, man is it a long one!!!). I guess I can come across a bit harsh when I go off on a tangent (my g/f tells me this all the time) and this has caused some personal attacks against me the past. Your opinion about what you feel would be a better strongman contest is valid and well expressed, I wished only to express my opinion as well and hope I didn't alienate you in the process.

[Mike Westerling]

:D: If Derek really was taking it personally, then he'd start a thread about it, I'd call him out for being sensitive, others would agree and tell him he has nothing to worry about, and Jono would post a funny picture somewhere.

ahaha, curling shirts. If those ever get made you can forget using a squat rack, EVER.

I almost fell out of my chair laughing at these!
-Mike

[Ashley Christopher Moore]

Derek,what you said was fine.
No worries about the rant. I rant myself on several posts. That's what happens when you are passionate about something. That is a good thing. I appreciate your insight.