I guess we are all freakishly strong...well most of us!! LOL

[Mac Smith]

I'm a member of another forum (no not bodybuilding.com, but close), where most of the guys are "training for size not strength, and low bodyfat levels", LOL!!! Some guy posted what he thinks is strong and he put up this chart. It seemed a bit low to me as I know high school athletes who would be considered 'elite' by these standards. They told me I must live in Valhalla or Mt. Olympus or something when I laughed at it.

I figured this would boost most of the members here, at least for a day!! Enjoy and discuss!!!

http://www.crossfit.com/cf-journal/WLSTANDARDS.pdf

[Steve Trippe]

What is amusing, is that that chart is supposedly from the crossfit website...

I train at a crossfit, and at our gym, the girls would laugh at the mens standards. We have at least one girl with an "elite" mens deadlift.

I suppose it's all in your perception...

EDIT: I must've been reading it wrong... she isn't at mens elite, she is well above womens elite, but close to the mens elite...

I'm elite in a few of them, but not all... 548 pull at 181 is respectable... not elite, but respectable...

[Andrew.Cook]

Well, Mac, I can officially say I am among those who are not freakishly strong. Not sure I agree with the elite levels, but I'm not there and at least this chart gives me a shot at being elite in this lifetime :D

[Brandon Campbell]

WOOOHOO Im elite for a 320+ man, that means i can gain 50lbs of fat and still be elite!

thanks mac i needed an ego boost.:BB:

now excuse me im going to go clean 135 x100 reps crossfit style






jk.....

[Mac Smith]

Well, Mac, I can officially say I am among those who are not freakishly strong. Not sure I agree with the elite levels, but I'm not there and at least this chart gives me a shot at being elite in this lifetime :D

Andrew, my man!!! No disrespect intended, brotha!!! I'm sure you'll smash the elite level soon enough. But my rant was based on the fact that on this other forum I'm getting blasted from all angles for being a jacked fatty! LOL!!! Now I know there has been this discussion on this forum before about who is stronger, blah, blah, blah (cue Wesley, Lol), but these guys on this other forum consider Derrick Poundstone, Kaz, and JPS fattys as well. The absurdity is funny over there, but there aren't many powerlifter/strongmen on the forum, plus I like getting into fights with wanna-be bodybuilders!!!

I just thought this was funny and wanted to know what strength athletes thought of these charts.

[Billy Wolt]

Yey I'm almost advanced.

[John Majefski]

I would say if you look at all of the population it is probably correct........now just strongmen and strength athletes maybe not

[Adam Keep]

Well I think it is directed at people that do crossfit as their main workout. If that is true then those numbers are hard to attain. We have plenty of crossfit guys here at work and their powerlifting/strength levels aren't that great, but if you include their running and endurance they are some seriously fit guys. The point of crossfit is to be ready for anything, but not really a master of any type of fitness.

I do agree thogugh that the numbers are pretty low.

[Bob Toth]

It's a different forum, a different group of individuals, people with different goals then us..
The chart comes from Rippetoe's Starting Strength book.. and he is quite respected across a lot of different communities of athletics and strength.

I don't think many of us are in this sport for the way our bodies look...
and the "elite" ranking are pretty good, but it doesn't mean you are going to compete against Olympic level athletes or the Poundstone's of the world.. they are the top 1% of the top 1%... it just means that you strong for any person.. and should probably know that for every 100 people you meet in regular life, only 1 of them is elite.

I think the numbers are pretty good... I would love to hit all of those elite numbers, especially the powerclean.. and I'm only Elite in 1 myself.

Lets not judge too harshly.. we all want to be freaks.. and stronger then 99 other guys we meet...:F:

[AndrewPalmer]

I think those numbers look right to me. These aren't the numbers for an elite powerlifter, they are the numbers for an elite human being.

I would be utterly shocked to find out that even 1 in 1000 men on the street had an elite number from that chart in anything but deadlift. I only say that with deadlift because lots of farmers and construction workers have inordinately strong backs and may pull more than expected.

Now among powerlifters and strongmen the standards will be higher since we have goals that are higher than the average population.

I'll put it this way. I fall into the 320 plus class. I'm within 25 pounds of the elite military press but I'm not quite there and I train overhead ALL THE TIME. What percentage of 320+ pound guys out there are going to even come close. I'd imagine its an almost zero percentage. I'd imagine its the same for anyone over the 181 weight class.

[Derek Girven]

well it stoked my ego a little im in the advanced catagory on all lifts. someday to be elite and well beyond i hope.

[Mac Smith]

Don't get me wrong fellas. I'm not trying to come across cocky or demeaning in my original post. I just wanted to know what the strength community thought about this chart as opposed to the bodybuilding community. That's all. I've been fortunate to be elite, according to this chart, for quite sometime. By know means do I wish to devalue the hardwork and determination those have put in even though they aren't at these levels.

[Declan Mac Daid]

Is it in pounds or kilos?

[Anthony Esquerdo]

Yey I'm almost advanced.

hahahahaha billy ur stronger the u look and then u think

[Mac Smith]

Is it in pounds or kilos?

Funny thing is Declan, I asked the same question on the other forum when it was first put up. Why? Because I was comparing it to elite powerlifter numbers of some feds. HAHAHAHA!!!

[Steve Trippe]

I hope that some day I'm big enough that members of some internet forum think I'm too big and bulky...

On second thought, I'll just find a swimming/diving message board... thats a lot easier than eating and lifting...

[Alex Klotz]

I'm around the cusp of intermediate and advanced. Sounds about right.

[Derek Girven]

i gotcha mac, i think we all know what you meant with the post. im glad to be considered on the upper side of the strength curve even if its just the pretty lifters or regular people. ill keep putting in the work and someday, god willing will be a beast like lots of guys out there.

[Jay Lee]

if those stats are for highschoolers.... than nobody in my district would match even one elite lift....... 595 for deadlift...395 or something bench......... these are ridiculous numbers if its for highschool

[Brian Carley]

Sweet...I'm elite...I still need to get stronger...good ego boost!!!

[Mac Smith]

if those stats are for highschoolers.... than nobody in my district would match even one elite lift....... 595 for deadlift...395 or something bench......... these are ridiculous numbers if its for highschool

I don't know where you live, but there are several high school athletes I've been associated with that can match those numbers. Its definately not unheard of for an elite high school athlete.

[Jay Hagadorn]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Lee http://www.marunde-muscle.com/forum/../Forum/images_acps/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.marunde-muscle.com/forum/showthread.php?p=266545#post266545)
if those stats are for highschoolers.... than nobody in my district would match even one elite lift....... 595 for deadlift...395 or something bench......... these are ridiculous numbers if its for highschool


I don't know where you live, but there are several high school athletes I've been associated with that can match those numbers. Its definately not unheard of for an elite high school athlete.

I agree Mac. I have a nephew who weighs 180. He squats 645, DL's the same and benches 375. His power clean is 300lbs. I do not know what he OHP's. He is a sophmore, and one strong kid, of course I am biased LOL...

[JEFF VANCO]

I say we roll 30 deep into crossfit and challenge everybody.

Marunde-muscle is the dog pound........only big dogs and their pups post here.

Those stats are bulls***

I just pulled a really easy 640 and pressed 320 and I still ain't s***.

[Mac Smith]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Lee http://www.marunde-muscle.com/forum/../Forum/images_acps/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.marunde-muscle.com/forum/showthread.php?p=266545#post266545)
if those stats are for highschoolers.... than nobody in my district would match even one elite lift....... 595 for deadlift...395 or something bench......... these are ridiculous numbers if its for highschool




I agree Mac. I have a nephew who weighs 180. He squats 645, DL's the same and benches 375. His power clean is 300lbs. I do not know what he OHP's. He is a sophmore, and one strong kid, of course I am biased LOL...

Hahaha! I hear you Jay. I didn't want to brag on my oldest boy and he's just a frosh. I didn't want to seem too biased myself! LOL!!


I say we roll 30 deep into crossfit and challenge everybody.

Marunde-muscle is the dog pound........only big dogs and their pups post here.

Those stats are bulls***

I just pulled a really easy 640 and pressed 320 and I still ain't s***.

WORD UP, JEFF!!!!:YR:

[Gabriel Wells]

Mostly elite and a couple advanced rankings by those means...well thats not too bad since I consider myself stronger than most normal people.

Mac, I have seen this chart or one similar to it...

Thanks for the ego stroke! LOL:BB:

[Paul Savage]

of course most of us are freakishly strong, were strongmen! thats like going onto a board full of a 100m sprinters an saying 'i guess we can all run fast then'

[Kevin Cronin]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Lee http://www.marunde-muscle.com/forum/../Forum/images_acps/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.marunde-muscle.com/forum/showthread.php?p=266545#post266545)
if those stats are for highschoolers.... than nobody in my district would match even one elite lift....... 595 for deadlift...395 or something bench......... these are ridiculous numbers if its for highschool




I agree Mac. I have a nephew who weighs 180. He squats 645, DL's the same and benches 375. His power clean is 300lbs. I do not know what he OHP's. He is a sophmore, and one strong kid, of course I am biased LOL...

I didnt actually look at the chart, but I'd agree with Jay Lee. Not that the numbers are unheard of, but of all the guys I played with and coached, I know ONE who benched those numbers (my buddy hit a 405 bench as a senior.) Granted we never trained deadlift, but I think my best clean was 275x2 or something, and I didnt hit 300 until I was 230 and a grown man. Heck Hag, i outweigh your nephew by 70 lbs and cant beat him on ANY of those stats. I'm definitely not the strongest guy around, but I'm not the weakest either. In fact, most of us are probably the strongest people that our friends/family (excluding training partners) know. For a 16 year old who's becoming a young man, but still has a bit of child in him, those numbers are great.

of course most of us are freakishly strong, were strongmen! thats like going onto a board full of a 100m sprinters an saying 'i guess we can all run fast then'
Well, kinda. But it's more like going to a board of recreational sprinters, 90-99% of whom will never make the olympics, and being surprised that they're classified as "elite" or "olympic-level"

[Stu Christensen]

Just so that everyone knows, here is the description of the chart and what its purpose is:

The standards presented in the following tables represent a performance
that can be reasonably expected of an athlete at various levels of training
advancement using standard full range-of-motion barbell exercises. In the tables
above, the term"untrained" refers to the expected level of strength in a healthy
individual who has not trained on the exercise before but can performit
correctly. This represents the minimumlevel of strength required to maintain a
reasonable quality of life in a sedentary individual. "Novice" means a person
training regularly for a period of 3-9 months. This strength level supports the
demands of vigorous recreational activities. An "intermediate" is a person who
has engaged in regular training for up to two years. The intermediate level
indicates some degree of specialization in the exercises and a high level of
performance at the recreational level. The term"advanced" refers to an individual
with multi-year training experience with definite goals in the higher levels of
competitive athletics. The term"elite" refers specifically to athletes competing in
strength sports. Less than 1%of the weight training population will attain this
level.

Notice the multiple references to "recreation:, "athletics" and "athlete"... not strongman, or powerlifter, or weightlifter etc.

[Andrew.Cook]

I think I'm reasonably strong when put against the average guy. I'm pretty weak when compared to other strongman competitors. I don't know anyone outside of strongman and my training group that doesn't think lifting and loading a 300lb stone is less than superhuman :) It is all perspective.

[Steve Trippe]

The term"elite" refers specifically to athletes competing in
strength sports. Less than 1%of the weight training population will attain this
level.


I dig it... better work on my squat...

[Justin Blake]

I think the chart numbers are accurate. Just another opinion to add to the mix

[Jay O'Neill]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Lee http://www.marunde-muscle.com/forum/../Forum/images_acps/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.marunde-muscle.com/forum/showthread.php?p=266545#post266545)
if those stats are for highschoolers.... than nobody in my district would match even one elite lift....... 595 for deadlift...395 or something bench......... these are ridiculous numbers if its for highschool




I agree Mac. I have a nephew who weighs 180. He squats 645, DL's the same and benches 375. His power clean is 300lbs. I do not know what he OHP's. He is a sophmore, and one strong kid, of course I am biased LOL...

I'm callin you on that one hagadorn...VIDEO please!

[Jay Hagadorn]

No vid, but here's his lifts from the Feb state comp. I'll see if he has any video.

These lifts are in a 3 lift meet that he did the beginning of February.

[AndrewPalmer]

Jay. I think these are meant to be raw numbers. I assume these are more to put people in line with the "Crossfit Total" type of contests where it is squat/dead/military press, all no equipment. In the one I did for a buddy they didn't even allow a belt (if I remember right).

I'm definitely not trying to downgrade your nephew because he is obviously a strong kid, its just an apples and oranges comparison. How heavy was that deadlift. That would be a much closer comparison to these numbers and he's still likely to be near the elite numbers for his weight.

edit: I want to add, that any high school kid who is hitting these elite numbers unequipped is a total freak. I'm sure lots of kids hit one of them but I doubt many at all hit them all.

[CharlesDMickey]

I'm pretty sure that chart is from Starting Strength or maybe Practical Programming.

Yeah - many people on this board would fall into Elite status. But people who compete in SM are a very VERY small portion of those who train. Those who actually do well in a SM contest are most certainly Elite.

But it's never good enough for people like us. Most of us would never consider ourselves "Elite" because we know many people stronger than ourselves.

[Jay Hagadorn]

Agreed mick.

This is the site that the chart came from, don't give crossfit too much credit, nor is this a "chart" for high schoolers:

http://www.aasgaardco.com/

Andrew, my nephew is 15. These #'s are for adult men on the chart. To defend him, yes he can blow away all those #'s for a 181#er. Unless you think single ply IPF reg gear is doing all the work for him...

[Mike Zylinski]

I love charts like this. I'm actually proud to be in the advanced category for most my lifts, but am way off for power cleans and barely there for bench. I recognize those as my major weaknesses and have been trying to improve. I 1st saw this chart a few years back I believe and think it helps show relative weakness. A lot of guys ask 'what are good numbers.....?' when they 1st start out and the answer is always 'just lift'. But it helps to see other guys workout logs, strength standards, etc... to see if you have holes in your game. Plus, I like the elite #s as goals to shoot for :)

Critcal bench had a chart for strength standards by football position, it is blocked from work but should be easy to find.

Someday, I'll be Elite by 2009 standards, but by then the damn bar will be higher!! lol, this is what happens when you associate with freaks ;)

[Eric Hubbard]

I only looked at the 275s, but the powerlifting total considered Elite by the Crossfit Table is about 80 pounds less than the Raw Ellite totals published by one of the raw feds. Not too far off, but then again, what does Elite really mean anyway. Take those tables and add about 25% and I think they would be a better representation for those of us involved in strength sports.

[Jay O'Neill]

No vid, but here's his lifts from the Feb state comp. I'll see if he has any video.

These lifts are in a 3 lift meet that he did the beginning of February.

Proof enough for me Jay... strong kid!

[Jay O'Neill]

I'm pretty sure that chart is from Starting Strength or maybe Practical Programming.

Yeah - many people on this board would fall into Elite status. But people who compete in SM are a very VERY small portion of those who train. Those who actually do well in a SM contest are most certainly Elite.

But it's never good enough for people like us. Most of us would never consider ourselves "Elite" because we know many people stronger than ourselves.

Yes this is from Mark Riptoe.... I think that speaks for itself.

[AndrewPalmer]

Agreed mick.

This is the site that the chart came from, don't give crossfit too much credit, nor is this a "chart" for high schoolers:

http://www.aasgaardco.com/

Andrew, my nephew is 15. These #'s are for adult men on the chart. To defend him, yes he can blow away all those #'s for a 181#er. Unless you think single ply IPF reg gear is doing all the work for him...


Definitely no need to defend him. He's clearly a strong kid. I wasn't trying to undercut him a bit. I was just making the observation that equipped lifting is going to have different numbers than raw lifting which is what I think this chart represents.

[Nikhil Rao]

yeah in context of 'human being' or even 'physically fit human being' I think they're fine.

I'm advanced and darn near elite on everything except deadlift. Granted I was 'intermediate' in most of those even before I started lifting lol. Which shows you just how pathetic my gains have been over the past 2 years.

[BillTenbroeck]

According the chart I am (198 category)

Elite in the Press
Above Advanced in the Squat but not quite Elite
Almost Elite in the Bench
Almost Elite in the DL
Above Intermediate in the Power Clean but not Advanced

I say that chart is pretty accurate. With the exception of the power clean I need a 327 (yeah right).

I would also say there category for elite is accurate and that less than 1% of trainers can meet those goals in those lifts. I know for damn sure MOST 198 cannot

Press- 234
Squat- 504
Bench- 362
DL- 567
Power Clean- 327

[Corey DuCharme]

The chart seems fair and puts me at intermediate, which depressed me a little at first. Thinking about it though, it is a boost for me. I spend too much time reading about all you freaks here, which makes me feel completely weak most of the time. Intermediate is actually an improvement!!

To support Mac and Vanco's comments about the caliber of athletes on this board:

If I, one of the weakest guys here, am placed as high as intermediate, I guess we are a pretty strong bunch of guys and girls!

[Richard Duce]

I still think that the old 400 squat, 300 bench and 500 dead are good targets for the average joe to go for. I think anything over this for a man and you are a strong person. Dont forget that a lot of guys on here indeed borderline if not indeed elite level athletes. For us normal people we have to set our sights a little lower. This is indeed a very strong forum!

[Kimberly]

That chart makes me elite in everything except my power clean...I'm only advanced in that. Even in the mens category at my weight I'm novice to advanced in some areas lol I think of myself as pretty average usually but I guys all the intimidated guys are right ... I am a :F::eek:

For the purpose on the chart, I think those numbers are pretty good... problem is we are ALL FREAKS LOL We don't need charts .. only the stones and logs and tires can judge our strength!!! :)

[Matthew White]

I would say for a crossfitter those numbers are elite, however, I think to blow their minds, the powers that be on this forum should make a "reasonable" chart themselves for strongmen and women, that would actually probably make me feel far better about myself knowing where I stand among the strong than where I stand among the fluffy. ;p

(no disrespect, I've been doing crossfit 2x a week to help fat loss and its got me down to 290 and I just stopped doing it to start gaining my strength back, so I know crossfit is a tough workout in itself, but has very little or nothing at all to do with strength)

But yeah, that would be awsome if some of the guys on here put there heads together and made some strongman charts, throw some events in there as well.

[Brandon Campbell]

chart for strongman elite

deadlift 800+
over head press 400+ on all implements
Bench (for those that choose to do it) 500+
squat 700+
Cleans 400+
Stones 400+ in series to medium high boxes or for reps to really high box
farmers 385+ each hand
yoke 900+ for 50+ feet

thats bout right for the elite lol this is where elite starts! before people start spouting some of the pro numbers! if you can do this and are not a pro, then you need to go do a pro show!

[Scott Porter]

The point of crossfit is to be ready for anything, but not really a master of any type of fitness.

I do agree thogugh that the numbers are pretty low.

The problem with "being ready for anything" and "not a master of any type of fitness" is that you end up being average at everything.

I'm digressing some but crossfit has become quite popular within the fire deparment I work for. The problem I have is that most of the work we do is more anaerobic and strength-related rather than being a crossfit 25 rep fest of 5 rounds of an exercise(s) that seems to be drawn out of a hat.

Also, if you want to be lean, muscular, and in condition, than high intense cardio anaerobic work and more strength work is optimal over running distances, doing 15+ reps with light weight, and only using 50% more weight than girls.

[Brandon Campbell]

HAHA 50% more weight then girls AWSOME!

[Matthew White]

chart for strongman elite

deadlift 800+
over head press 400+ on all implements
Bench (for those that choose to do it) 500+
squat 700+
Cleans 400+
Stones 400+ in series to medium high boxes or for reps to really high box
farmers 385+ each hand
yoke 900+ for 50+ feet

thats bout right for the elite lol this is where elite starts! before people start spouting some of the pro numbers! if you can do this and are not a pro, then you need to go do a pro show!

That sounds reasonable for elite, what about advanced, intermediate, novice, and untrained? I figure I probably fall in intermediate for most stuff, and novice for overhead press. ;p

[DKirby]

Another thing to remember is these #s are probably all raw, or maybe a belt only. Certainly no knee wraps, squat & DL suits, bench shirts, etc.

[Mac Smith]

Another thing to remember is these #s are probably all raw, or maybe a belt only. Certainly no knee wraps, squat & DL suits, bench shirts, etc.

I don't know about that, most of the videos I've seen of some of the top guys there are using deadlift suits and squat suits. But those numbers are definitely great for elite. Definitely makes me re-evaluate my goals.

[Ryan Nielson]

Actually those power clean numbers looked really high to me or maybe I'm really bad at those. All the other lifts I'm around the elite numbers on.

[Brandon Campbell]

That sounds reasonable for elite, what about advanced, intermediate, novice, and untrained? I figure I probably fall in intermediate for most stuff, and novice for overhead press. ;p

well you can figure it out on your own! lol

just look at similar level contests strongman easy to make a chart for;)

silver level = novice intermediate = gold advanced = plat and Elite = Plat + if you can do the following shows with ease and place high you are in that catagory!

[DKirby]

Another thing to remember is these #s are probably all raw, or maybe a belt only. Certainly no knee wraps, squat & DL suits, bench shirts, etc.

I don't know about that, most of the videos I've seen of some of the top guys there are using deadlift suits and squat suits. But those numbers are definitely great for elite. Definitely makes me re-evaluate my goals.

As far as the elite strongman #s Matthew White posted, yes. But I was assuming the crossfit #s were refering to ones without PL suits/wraps.

[DKirby]

chart for strongman elite

deadlift 800+
over head press 400+ on all implements
Bench (for those that choose to do it) 500+
squat 700+
Cleans 400+
Stones 400+ in series to medium high boxes or for reps to really high box
farmers 385+ each hand
yoke 900+ for 50+ feet

thats bout right for the elite lol this is where elite starts! before people start spouting some of the pro numbers! if you can do this and are not a pro, then you need to go do a pro show!

Thing is probably 90% of your HW pros could hit a 700 sq but only maybe 10%-20% could hit 400+ on the log, axle.

Agree on the DL, OHP all implements, cleans. I'd say for HW for an equal % of pros (say between 1/4-1/2) to be able to do each:
suited deadlift 800+
over head press 375+ on all implements
Bench (for those that choose to do it) 500+ (no shirt)
suited squat 800+
Cleans (for those that chose to do it) 400+
Stones 300/325/350/375/400/425 either to 64"/60"/56"/52"/48" boxes or all 5 to around 52" or 5 375ish to around 52", all with one minute time limits.
farmers 380+ each hand for 50'/350+ for 100'
(solid) yoke 1000+ for 50'; 900 for 100'

I would be elite on none of these (maybe close on a couple) But I guess everyone has a different opinion on all these #s.