Zydrunas Savickas = Strongest Man Who's Ever Lived?

[Tony Christopher]

I know this topic has been (and will continue to be) debated to death ... but as a guy who's been following the strength game for close to 40 years (I'll turn 50 next year) I think if I were asked to pick the strongest of the strong, all time, it would have to be Big Z.

No disrespect to Kaz, MVM, JPS, Mariusz, Capes, Ahola, Reinhoudt, Rezadeh and all the other strength legends who have competed in various sports over the year, but I think Zs victory in WSM 2009 (a competition that "wasn't supposed to suit him") really cements it. It shows that whatever the strength goal, when Z focuses on it, he will achieve it.

To cement that opinion, I'd love to see Z do a raw powerlifting meet just to see what kinds of numbers he can put up.

He already holds a number of Lithuanian powerlifting records: 285.5 (627) RAW bench, 407.5 (896.5) dead, 425.5 (936.1) squat, 1090 (2,398) total. But to the best of my knowledge those #s were set a number of years ago when he was 50 pounds lighter and not nearly as strong. I don't know if the squat or deadlift numbers were raw, but even if they're weren't, gear adds a negligible amount to one's pull, and years ago under IPF rules, added a negligible amount to one's squat. Hence, you've got to figure he was good for a raw 2250-2300 even as a wet-behind-the-ears 320 pounder. ;-)

Hence, you have to think that Z would be good for a legitimate 2400+ total raw these days ... something we haven't seen since powerlifters lifted their own weight back in the 70s and 80s.

I also can't help but wonder ... just for kicks and giggles, what kind of # he could put up doing an olympic style clean and jerk. I'm under no illusion that he'd set a world record, but you have to figure that a guy who can press a nearly 500lb log over his head would be able to hit over 500ld with an olympic bar if he trained the technique for a few months.

[Jay Hagadorn]

Tony-

Just for the sake of dicussion, I do not believe anyone can truly be labeled "the strongest of all time". Maybe in their specific sport. I believe many people lose sight of the fact that strongman is an athletic strength sport with a whole lot of movement.

Powerlifting-Strong, but gut out 3 lifts in linear plane...not super athletic

Olympic lifting-Very sport specific strength here. Two lifts is what you train for. From the floor to overhead.

Strongman-You do it all, but you have to be able to move to be good.

I think currently Zydrunas is the strongest strongman on the planet...but wait a few months, you never know what will happen. One thing is for sure, you can't be the best at everything all at once.

[Tony Moses]

I'd probably say Savickas is as close as anyone can probably be to being considered the strongest man alive. I don't think you'll ever have a hands-down answer just because strong can mean different things, things that aren't necessarily conducive to one another. I don't necessarily think he won a contest that didn't suit him. People assumed it didn't suit him because the weights tend to be lighter than other top-level shows, and because Z carries some noticeable bodyfat, and Mariusz, who won 5 WSM shows carries very low-bodyfat. I seriously think that's where the whole Z isn't suited for WSM thing came from, lol. It is pretty ridiculous in my opinion.

Olympic lifting is very technical. Strength can get you far though. Ken Patera was considered to be the strongest lifter of his era (Alexeyev even admitted it), but he wasn't as technically sound as his contemporaries and it hurt him. It can also get you to the top though, Reza Zadeh has 2 Olympic gold medals and his form is about as good as the average high school football player on youtube (I am exaggerating of course, lol, but his form is pretty horrendous for a world-class lifter). I just don't like to speculate about how someone would do in Olympic lifting based on their strength because it is so technical . . . honestly, I'd rather speculate how someone would do in Oly lifting based on vertical jumps and 40-yard dash times than I wold based on static lifts.

A lot of strongmen get their asses chapped when someone on TV refers to the SHW olympic champ in weightlifting to as the strongest man in the world, lol, it's just a phrase, a phrase that pre-dates the sport of strongman by a long time, I don't think they mean anything personal by it, and if they knew much about lifting weights they probably wouldn't say it because it is a little silly if you're "in the know," lol.

Then you've got some guys who were just born to excel at gym lifts, but they just can't apply that strength to something like strongman because they weren't blessed enough height and frame/hand size to manhandle the implements. If you're 5'7 with small hands, then a 600 raw bench and an 850 deadlift won't do as much for you as it would someone 6'2 with a pair of catcher's mits for hands.

But, since we live in an imperfect world and we'll never really, truly know who the strongest man alive is at any time, I'd say Savickas is about as close a prototype as you can get. I think Poundstone is also a pretty good prototype too, he has no achilles heel and can finish top 2 in the entire world on any given event on any given day.

[Brandon Smith]

A lot of strongmen get their asses chapped when someone on TV refers to the SHW olympic champ in weightlifting to as the strongest man in the world, lol, it's just a phrase, a phrase that pre-dates the sport of strongman by a long time, I don't think they mean anything personal by it, and if they knew much about lifting weights they probably wouldn't say it because it is a little silly if you're "in the know," lol.

Same as the "World's Fastest Man" is the title given to the 100m Olympic champ, even though the average speed of the 200m is usually faster than the 100m. Or the winner of the Olympic decathalon is the "World's Greatest Athlete". It's all just traditions, and isn't necessarily true!

[WesleyInman]

I'd have to see him compete in real life to make an idea just regarding today's competitors just to have an opinion.

Something I never understand is why people see a bigger number only as most impressive. For example Z weighs what some days around 385-400lbs?? His bench is 6+, thats still only like 160% of his bodyweight. A 360 stone is less than 100% of his bodyweight. Take your bodyweight and match it up, you would literally throw that stone in the air at that weight. A 750 deadlift is less than double his weight! A 340 axle is considerably less than 100% of his bodyweight, is 11 reps all that amazing??

Im more impressed (maybe Im one of the few) with someone like Sadler or Marku who weighs 260-290 and doubles, triples, and quadruples their weights on many of their lifts. Even bodybuilder Franco Columbo used to lift cars and refridgerators and carry them I dont think he was even 220 at the time.

[Alex Klotz]

Same as the "World's Fastest Man" is the title given to the 100m Olympic champ, even though the average speed of the 200m is usually faster than the 100m.

Fortunately Usain Bolt outran that problem!

As others have said, there's no real way to determine who is "the strongest" because the standards are all different. Sure Andy Bolton can deadlift 1000 lb, but how many strongman competitions has he won? Sure Zydrunas Savickas has won every strongman title there is, but how much can be lift over his head? And sure Leonid Taranenko can lift 586 lb from the ground and lift it over his head, but how much can he deadlift? And the cycle continues.

The only way to determine who the strongest is, without leaving it open to interpretation, is to see who can lift the most weight, period. This is either Paul Anderson or some guy named S. Schmidt.

[Kevin Cronin]

I'd have to see him compete in real life to make an idea just regarding today's competitors just to have an opinion.

Something I never understand is why people see a bigger number only as most impressive. For example Z weighs what some days around 385-400lbs?? His bench is 6+, thats still only like 160% of his bodyweight. A 360 stone is less than 100% of his bodyweight. Take your bodyweight and match it up, you would literally throw that stone in the air at that weight. A 750 deadlift is less than double his weight! A 340 axle is considerably less than 100% of his bodyweight, is 11 reps all that amazing??

Im more impressed (maybe Im one of the few) with someone like Sadler or Marku who weighs 260-290 and doubles, triples, and quadruples their weights on many of their lifts. Even bodybuilder Franco Columbo used to lift cars and refridgerators and carry them I dont think he was even 220 at the time.
That's because you're 5'1" and have teh metabolism of a 13 year-old 3-sport athlete smoking meth :p

[Adrian Kimmett]

That would make a good Pay Per View event if you invited all the top Powerlifters, Olympic Weightlifters and Strongmen and had them settle this argument. Have them all do the Clean and Jerk, Snatch, Bench, Deadlift, Squat, and say 5 of the most common Strongman events and whoever puts up the biggest total in all ten lifts is the strongest. I would think that Zydrunas would certainly be one of the favorites in an event like this.

[Jay O'Neill]

I'd have to see him compete in real life to make an idea just regarding today's competitors just to have an opinion.

Something I never understand is why people see a bigger number only as most impressive. For example Z weighs what some days around 385-400lbs?? His bench is 6+, thats still only like 160% of his bodyweight. A 360 stone is less than 100% of his bodyweight. Take your bodyweight and match it up, you would literally throw that stone in the air at that weight. A 750 deadlift is less than double his weight! A 340 axle is considerably less than 100% of his bodyweight, is 11 reps all that amazing??

Im more impressed (maybe Im one of the few) with someone like Sadler or Marku who weighs 260-290 and doubles, triples, and quadruples their weights on many of their lifts. Even bodybuilder Franco Columbo used to lift cars and refridgerators and carry them I dont think he was even 220 at the time.

Great Post!

[Kalle Beck]

That would make a good Pay Per View event if you invited all the top Powerlifters, Olympic Weightlifters and Strongmen and had them settle this argument. Have them all do the Clean and Jerk, Snatch, Bench, Deadlift, Squat, and say 5 of the most common Strongman events and whoever puts up the biggest total in all ten lifts is the strongest. I would think that Zydrunas would certainly be one of the favorites in an event like this.

Misha would have to be the clear favorite.

[Patrick McGuffin]

Adding in pound for pound just makes the whole thing to complicated. Niam Suleymangolu (pretty sure I butchered that name) would probably be most peoples vote for tops. Pound for pound he can snatch more than most people could squat or deadlift. Overall I would say savikas for sure though.

[Billy Wolt]

I'd have to see him compete in real life to make an idea just regarding today's competitors just to have an opinion.

Something I never understand is why people see a bigger number only as most impressive. For example Z weighs what some days around 385-400lbs?? His bench is 6+, thats still only like 160% of his bodyweight. A 360 stone is less than 100% of his bodyweight. Take your bodyweight and match it up, you would literally throw that stone in the air at that weight. A 750 deadlift is less than double his weight! A 340 axle is considerably less than 100% of his bodyweight, is 11 reps all that amazing??

Im more impressed (maybe Im one of the few) with someone like Sadler or Marku who weighs 260-290 and doubles, triples, and quadruples their weights on many of their lifts. Even bodybuilder Franco Columbo used to lift cars and refridgerators and carry them I dont think he was even 220 at the time.

As far as bodyweight goes, just because someone weighs twice as much, does not mean they should lift twice as much. If that were true, the deadlift record would be 1600lb, and your average 300lber should be pulling 1300+.

As far as what is impressive, that is subjective. I personally find the biggest weight lifted to be the most impressive.

and yes, Z's 340 x 11 axle is impressive because he strict pressed all of them. but then again, i think pressing should be a press and not a jerk...just like in the olympics when they do the jerk they cannot press out the weight.

[J. Alexander]

but then again, i think pressing should be a press and not a jerk...just like in the olympics when they do the jerk they cannot press out the weight.


Nice to know I'm not alone in thinking this....:)

[jay lyttle]

if your going to talk strongest man who ever lived, you cant do so without mentioning mark henry! he achieved top status in all 3 major strength sports! [oly, powerlifting and strongman] as far as the worlds greatest athlete, who better than a decathlete? they run 4 distance, for speed, they hurdle, jump, vault, and throw all in 2 days. in my mind the winner of that is truly the worlds greatest athlete! savickas, kaz, henry? you could argue that one forever with no end!

[jay lyttle]

if you had a comp with oly lifting powerlifting and strongman events, mark henry would be really tuff to beat! especially if he had some time to train. agin, he has been at the top level in all 3.

[Tony Moses]

It's kind of funny how WSM started out as a contest to see who was the strongest strength athlete, but used odd events so as not to favor any one discipline . . . now it's evolved into such a sport in its own right that we have to dream up another competition to see who is really the strongest!!

[Eric Todd]

Fortunately Usain Bolt outran that problem!

As others have said, there's no real way to determine who is "the strongest" because the standards are all different. Sure Andy Bolton can deadlift 1000 lb, but how many strongman competitions has he won? Sure Zydrunas Savickas has won every strongman title there is, but how much can be lift over his head? And sure Leonid Taranenko can lift 586 lb from the ground and lift it over his head, but how much can he deadlift? And the cycle continues.

The only way to determine who the strongest is, without leaving it open to interpretation, is to see who can lift the most weight, period. This is either Paul Anderson or some guy named S. Schmidt.

Steve Scmidt can also lift the most weight with his teeth, as well as pull the iggest trains with his teeth. He has the official back lift record (I believe Paul Andersons was done by leveraging one end up, same as Steve Justa). However, I am confident that if Zadrunis would backlift, the record would probably be shattered.
ET

[Brian_Worden]

I'd have to see him compete in real life to make an idea just regarding today's competitors just to have an opinion.

Something I never understand is why people see a bigger number only as most impressive. For example Z weighs what some days around 385-400lbs?? His bench is 6+, thats still only like 160% of his bodyweight. A 360 stone is less than 100% of his bodyweight. Take your bodyweight and match it up, you would literally throw that stone in the air at that weight. A 750 deadlift is less than double his weight! A 340 axle is considerably less than 100% of his bodyweight, is 11 reps all that amazing??

Im more impressed (maybe Im one of the few) with someone like Sadler or Marku who weighs 260-290 and doubles, triples, and quadruples their weights on many of their lifts. Even bodybuilder Franco Columbo used to lift cars and refridgerators and carry them I dont think he was even 220 at the time.

That is a good point... but... in regards to the heavier person... just because he is that much heavier... doesn't mean it's all muscle.

For Instance... Big Z is about 140lbs more than me. He has more fat (no offense to him... i am pretty soft myself), more skin, more bone, bigger organs, more tendon, ligament, ... most of that extra weight does not add to mechanical advantage. He doesn't have 140lbs of muscle on me.
While I agree that smaller guy feats are amazing... a 200lb guy that can deadlift 600lb is not necessarily the same as a 250lbs guy deadlifting 750lbs.

In my humble opinion. I am not a medical professional, nor a top notch strongman.:D

[Jay Hagadorn]

I'd have to see him compete in real life to make an idea just regarding today's competitors just to have an opinion.

Something I never understand is why people see a bigger number only as most impressive. For example Z weighs what some days around 385-400lbs?? His bench is 6+, thats still only like 160% of his bodyweight. A 360 stone is less than 100% of his bodyweight. Take your bodyweight and match it up, you would literally throw that stone in the air at that weight. A 750 deadlift is less than double his weight! A 340 axle is considerably less than 100% of his bodyweight, is 11 reps all that amazing??

Im more impressed (maybe Im one of the few) with someone like Sadler or Marku who weighs 260-290 and doubles, triples, and quadruples their weights on many of their lifts. Even bodybuilder Franco Columbo used to lift cars and refridgerators and carry them I dont think he was even 220 at the time.

Well just who is the strongest?
Lb for Lb rhis little Yale forklift lifts more than the big Cat, but in reality the Cat lifts five times more than the Yale.

Same concept in the next pics :D

[davebeers]

lb for lb could be debated all day long, and is IMO a debate only brought up by little guys

Big Z in my mind has proven that he is the best. There is no doubt he is stupid strong but there are other big fat strong guys who aren't on his level(glen ross comes to mind)
Z has now won just about every different venue of strongman there is. He is not only strong but also has the mobility and speed of maruiz.

He is the blend of just about every top strongman out there and has been very consistent over time. Results speak for themselves, its also nice that is a very soft-spoken and humble guy.

[Jay Hagadorn]

lb for lb could be debated all day long, and is IMO a debate only brought up by little guys

Big Z in my mind has proven that he is the best. There is no doubt he is stupid strong but there are other big fat strong guys who aren't on his level(glen ross comes to mind)
Z has now won just about every different venue of strongman there is. He is not only strong but also has the mobility and speed of maruiz.

He is the blend of just about every top strongman out there and has been very consistent over time. Results speak for themselves, its also nice that is a very soft-spoken and humble guy.

Best post of the day!

[WesleyInman]

lb for lb could be debated all day long, and is IMO a debate only brought up by little guys

Big Z in my mind has proven that he is the best. There is no doubt he is stupid strong but there are other big fat strong guys who aren't on his level(glen ross comes to mind)
Z has now won just about every different venue of strongman there is. He is not only strong but also has the mobility and speed of maruiz.

He is the blend of just about every top strongman out there and has been very consistent over time. Results speak for themselves, its also nice that is a very soft-spoken and humble guy.

I'm a little guy so maybe you have validity, but doesn't EVERYONE view strength this way, otherwise, why would their be weight classes in strongman, powerlifting, boxing, etc... It could just be a free for all, like an open meet, then no one "little" would enter since they wouldn't have a chance to win, and the only people considered strong are those 400lbs genetically.

I agree Z is awesome, but my whole point is hypothetically speaking, say you take Mariusk and pack on him 50 pounds of muscle, since he is all muscle versus Z who is fluffy as I believe Easton put it LOL. Maybe Ill take heat for this, but hands down Id put my life savings that Pudz would destroy him at 385 lean bodyweight in EVERY EVENT. Or what if Z lost 50lb of anything?? Could he compete like he does now, I doubt it.

One thing is, you guys are right, probably not worth hypotheticals (hard to stay away from) but I just wanted to explain a point of view. I know some of you agree, others will disagree, but either way look at all perspectives of it. So many variables, height, weight, bodyfat, etc, etc..

Z won this year so he has the title and right to call himself the Worlds Strongest Man as the title suggests. :)

[Vincent.Dametta]

Too difficult to even begin to fathom. There are so many levels of what can be considered strength.

Plain and simple - none of us have been around since the beginning of time so we have no idea who's the "strongest" man who ever lived. There could've been some man in the 1700s who didn't exhibit his strength in public who could've had an 800lb overhead press or something. Get my drift?

I think it would just be easier to just ask "who's your favorite strength athlete of all time?" LOL

[Vincent Dizenzo]

I'm a little guy so maybe you have validity, but doesn't EVERYONE view strength this way, otherwise, why would their be weight classes in strongman, powerlifting, boxing, etc... It could just be a free for all, like an open meet, then no one "little" would enter since they wouldn't have a chance to win, and the only people considered strong are those 400lbs genetically.

I agree Z is awesome, but my whole point is hypothetically speaking, say you take Mariusk and pack on him 50 pounds of muscle, since he is all muscle versus Z who is puffy as I believe Easton put it LOL. Maybe Ill take heat for this, but hands down Id put my life savings that Pudz would destroy him at 385 lean bodyweight in EVERY EVENT. Or what if Z lost 50lb of anything?? Could he compete like he does now, I doubt it.

One thing is, you guys are right, probably not worth hypotheticals (hard to stay away from) but I just wanted to explain a point of view. I know some of you agree, others will disagree, but either way look at all perspectives of it. So many variables, height, weight, bodyfat, etc, etc..

Z won this year so he has the title and right to call himself the Worlds Strongest Man as the title suggests. :)


I'm here to sign up for the 50 lbs. of solid. Single file line behind me please.

Marius is amazing, but Z is the strongest.

[Dennis Ruygrok]

IMO opinion Ahola and Mariusz were/are far more impressive than Zydrunas ever was/has been but yeah he probably is the strongest.

Dennis

[Ryan Phillips]

Jay Cutler

end of thread.

[dcarroll]

Reg Park.

Now it's the end of thread, Ryan. Haa Haa Haa.

[LouFatski]

IMO opinion Ahola and Mariusz were/are far more impressive than Zydrunas ever was/has been but yeah he probably is the strongest.

Dennis

Mariusz in his prime was more explosive than any strongman in history. Z earned his win but he has his weaknesses like any strongman.

[Jay Hagadorn]

Mariusz in his prime was more explosive than any strongman in history. Z earned his win but he has his weaknesses like any strongman.
And that is why he just one against arguably the best field ever???
Just curious...

[LouFatski]

I'm here to sign up for the 50 lbs. of solid. Single file line behind me please.

Marius is amazing, but Z is the strongest.

Z is stronger in the events he's more suitable for, and Mariusz is stronger in events more suited to himself.

[Jay Lee]

derek poundstone seems to be getting up their in the roster ;)

[BradyJones]

I'd have to see him compete in real life to make an idea just regarding today's competitors just to have an opinion.

Something I never understand is why people see a bigger number only as most impressive. For example Z weighs what some days around 385-400lbs?? His bench is 6+, thats still only like 160% of his bodyweight. A 360 stone is less than 100% of his bodyweight. Take your bodyweight and match it up, you would literally throw that stone in the air at that weight. A 750 deadlift is less than double his weight! A 340 axle is considerably less than 100% of his bodyweight, is 11 reps all that amazing??

Im more impressed (maybe Im one of the few) with someone like Sadler or Marku who weighs 260-290 and doubles, triples, and quadruples their weights on many of their lifts. Even bodybuilder Franco Columbo used to lift cars and refridgerators and carry them I dont think he was even 220 at the time.

ive heard others say that and i just dont agree with it.. by that theory lamar gant is the strongest man to ever live..

bw doesnt matter, its who lifts the heaviest, the most weight lifted is the strongest, the man who runs the fastest is the fastest! plain and simple.... kaz, henry, z are the strongest humans ever, they lifted the most weight in many different tests of strength.

[Jonathan Macfarlane]

I'm the best 320lb ballet dancer of all time. OF ALL TIME.

Strongest man ever needs to be decided based on who fronts up and is the strongest, regardless of what they weigh. It's pretty simple. Our sport is called strongman after all. Not ...'not quite as big but proportionally stronger and better looking-man.'

[MikeMastell]

I also can't agree with the pound for pound idea. If you're so damn strong compete up. But i think strong for your weight has it's place just not when comparing the strongest in the world.

[Jonathan Macfarlane]

I agree Z is awesome, but my whole point is hypothetically speaking, say you take Mariusk and pack on him 50 pounds of muscle, since he is all muscle versus Z who is fluffy as I believe Easton put it LOL. Maybe Ill take heat for this, but hands down Id put my life savings that Pudz would destroy him at 385 lean bodyweight in EVERY EVENT. Or what if Z lost 50lb of anything?? Could he compete like he does now, I doubt it.

:)

I'm sure if Mariusz could destroy Z at WSM weighing 385lbs lean, he'd do it. Some guys are just not built to be that big, and it would be detrimental/ impossible to get to that size and compete. You can't' hypothetical' anything here, cause it just hasn't, and won't happen. One could argue Mark Henry stood a chance of having a better record than Z... but fact is, he didn't, and potential doesn't mean jack if it isn't used.

[Patrick McGuffin]

Agreed, the only reason there are weight classes is so little people actually have a chance to compete and not get destroyed and be able to compare themselves with people around their size. At the end of the day though whoever can lift the most is the strongest, regardless of size.

[Michal Širůčka]

I agree Z is awesome, but my whole point is hypothetically speaking, say you take Mariusk and pack on him 50 pounds of muscle, since he is all muscle versus Z who is fluffy as I believe Easton put it LOL. Maybe Ill take heat for this, but hands down Id put my life savings that Pudz would destroy him at 385 lean bodyweight in EVERY EVENT. Or what if Z lost 50lb of anything?? Could he compete like he does now, I doubt it.

Thats like: "what if spiderman was treaten by radioactivity? would he beat hulk?"

If Marius packed another 50lbs of bodyweight (Im not saying pure muscle, because I dont find it possible), he might be stronger, but what about his speed? I dont think he would be able to keep his speed and endurance, which allows him to dominate some events. I think he knows what is best for him and gives him best chance to win. If it would mean come at 360, Im sure he would do it, but somehow... he wouldnt :)

[Mike Westerling]

I would agree that Z is overall the strongest man alive!
-Mike

[dave barron]

[QUOTE=Michal Širůčka;291516]Thats like: "what if spiderman was treaten by radioactivity? would he beat hulk?" [QUOTE]

This thread is officially off the rails now.

Hulk would smash.

[Ryan Brown]

I'm a little guy so maybe you have validity, but doesn't EVERYONE view strength this way, otherwise, why would their be weight classes in strongman, powerlifting, boxing, etc... It could just be a free for all, like an open meet, then no one "little" would enter since they wouldn't have a chance to win, and the only people considered strong are those 400lbs genetically.

I agree Z is awesome, but my whole point is hypothetically speaking, say you take Mariusk and pack on him 50 pounds of muscle, since he is all muscle versus Z who is fluffy as I believe Easton put it LOL. Maybe Ill take heat for this, but hands down Id put my life savings that Pudz would destroy him at 385 lean bodyweight in EVERY EVENT. Or what if Z lost 50lb of anything?? Could he compete like he does now, I doubt it.

One thing is, you guys are right, probably not worth hypotheticals (hard to stay away from) but I just wanted to explain a point of view. I know some of you agree, others will disagree, but either way look at all perspectives of it. So many variables, height, weight, bodyfat, etc, etc..

Z won this year so he has the title and right to call himself the Worlds Strongest Man as the title suggests. :)

you have weight classes so people of various sizes can compete. When talking strongest in the world weight classes go out the window. Nobody is arguing that say Pyrros Dimas (82.5 kg competotor--multiple gold medals) is stronger than Hossein Rezazdeh (hw competitor multiple golds). Rezazdeh is hands down stronger because he has bigger lifts. Dimmas is the strongest for his weight class, but Rezazdah is stronger even though he weighs a ton more. I am lb for lb much stronger now than I was when I was larger, but in terms of absolute strength I am much weaker. Physics makes it harder for a larger being to lift more weight as compared to its bodyweight--compare an ant to an elephant.

in sport I think hypotheticals or potentials are irrelevant. Who won or performed the best. AT this time Z has just beaten what most everyone agreed was the best field ever. His powerlifting numbers show that he likely would do unbelievably well in that sport. Mariusz chooses to stay lean--perhaps because he just wants to be lean, but perhaps because he feels he is most competitive that way. Either way it doesn't matter--Mariusz did not come in at a heavier BW, he lost the contest and Z was stronger.

As for the original question my guess is that Z is in fact the strongest human to have ever lived. He has the advantage over men of years gone by in a few respects--knowing the numbers to beat; modern training methods, etc. Almost certainly he is not the strongest if judged by genetic poential alone (if this, if that) but strongest actual person because he has great genetic potential combined with years of dedication to training and eating, etc. to make himself capable of doing what he does.

[John Cottrell]

All right this post is getting a little out of hand, and the truth be told in my 4 year old and 3 year old daughters eyes their daddy is the strongest man in the world and that is really all that matters right.:D

Everyone of us who competes deserves a standing ovation 1st, last who cares "IMO" We are all strongmen!!!!!!!!!

[Alex Klotz]

Steve Scmidt can also lift the most weight with his teeth, as well as pull the iggest trains with his teeth. He has the official back lift record (I believe Paul Andersons was done by leveraging one end up, same as Steve Justa). However, I am confident that if Zadrunis would backlift, the record would probably be shattered.
ET

Can you tell me more about this guy? All I've read is on an obscure records page and is that he has something like a 3500 lb harness lift. Where does he train? Has he competed? What are his other lifts like?

[WesleyInman]

you have weight classes so people of various sizes can compete. When talking strongest in the world weight classes go out the window. Nobody is arguing that say Pyrros Dimas (82.5 kg competotor--multiple gold medals) is stronger than Hossein Rezazdeh (hw competitor multiple golds). Rezazdeh is hands down stronger because he has bigger lifts. Dimmas is the strongest for his weight class, but Rezazdah is stronger even though he weighs a ton more. I am lb for lb much stronger now than I was when I was larger, but in terms of absolute strength I am much weaker. Physics makes it harder for a larger being to lift more weight as compared to its bodyweight--compare an ant to an elephant.

in sport I think hypotheticals or potentials are irrelevant. Who won or performed the best. AT this time Z has just beaten what most everyone agreed was the best field ever. His powerlifting numbers show that he likely would do unbelievably well in that sport. Mariusz chooses to stay lean--perhaps because he just wants to be lean, but perhaps because he feels he is most competitive that way. Either way it doesn't matter--Mariusz did not come in at a heavier BW, he lost the contest and Z was stronger.

As for the original question my guess is that Z is in fact the strongest human to have ever lived. He has the advantage over men of years gone by in a few respects--knowing the numbers to beat; modern training methods, etc. Almost certainly he is not the strongest if judged by genetic poential alone (if this, if that) but strongest actual person because he has great genetic potential combined with years of dedication to training and eating, etc. to make himself capable of doing what he does.

Awesome post!! Hypothetically speaking LOL, where do you guys place Jon Pall and Kaz on this list??

[Paul E Ohl]

The thread asks a question. Is big Z ( or so and so for that matter) the Strongest Man who ever lived ?

Let's bring it down to facts. And let's leave out the ratio of weight over bodyweight. That would take us back to the era where olympic weightlifting was struggling with the "Hoffman formula", a sophisticated chart that used mathematics to decide of who was best based on bodyweight x handicap
not on bodyweight class division.

Absolute strength has to deal with genetics, body mass and performance. And , to a certain extend, with the history of Strongman. As a matter of fact, the subject comes up every 50 years or so. It came up at the end of the XIXth Century. Again in the 50's. And then every 10 years, especially with Paul Anderson and, in the 80's, with Bill Kazmaier.

However, the issue of who could be the Strongest Ever does not concern WSM that much. Since 1977, with the exception of Kazmaier and Reeves Log Lift records, there wasn't too great a concern about registrerd records. Different attitude coming from Dr Todd and the Arnold's. And, for a little while after the split, from the IFSA.

So, if the question applies to modern times ( 1950 to present ) let's agree on at least 15 events and look at the track record of the candidates with regard to these events.

[Alex Klotz]

Ok, found his website.

http://steveschmidtmo.com/home.html

Is there anyone alive who has lifted more than 3515 lb?

[Jay Hagadorn]

So, if the question applies to modern times ( 1950 to present ) let's agree on at least 15 events and look at the track record of the candidates with regard to these events.

I agree with you Paul, except for this point. It can not be done. There truly is no track record (currently) in strongman.

There are no "standardized events". The now defunct IFSA was on their own track with standardized implements. The beauty of strongman is you never know what you are gonna get. Sometimes logs are slightly lighter or heavier than stated. Sometimes handles are narrower or wider. Farmers implements are always different sizes. Axles are rarely the same. Stones are stones, have they truly been weighed or is it just a guess, let alone natural stones, that can not be standardized due to dimensions of a stone. Deadlifts from different heights, with different wheels, with bounce, with no bounce, single rep max, for reps, yokes are rarely the same. Not to mention sometimes promoters inflate or deflate #'s, sometimes intentionally or unintentionally. Even your own record stone that Derek lifted was a "little" off.

Anyways, I am not criticizing you. I think you have the right idea with your contest you have held the last two years. But for a true track record there has to be standardization and calibration across the board...two things that strongman competitions lack...but then again that is the beauty of this sport...you never know what your gonna get!

[Eric Todd]

Ok, found his website.

http://steveschmidtmo.com/home.html

Is there anyone alive who has lifted more than 3515 lb?

glad to see you found it. He has competed for years in the USAWA. there is a meet in Columbia, Mo every Nov named after him. As far as I know, he just trains at his farm. Very good at the heavy lifts (Harness, back, hand and thigh, hip, etc).
ET

[Scott Tully]

I think Dennis Rogers is the strongest man to ever live!! Followed by that kid in High Schools uncle for benched 800 for reps and lifted 2000 lbs with his legs.

ST

[Aaron West]

I can't believe nobody's mentioned the great Isaac Nasser!:BB:

[Eric Todd]

I can't believe nobody's mentioned the great Isaac Nasser!:BB:

He doesnt come up as much as he used to for some reason. I did however, visit his website (http://www.drsize74.com/index2.html) the other day.
Et

[John Evans]

Dear all,

First sorry it’s a bit long.

I would like first to say well done to Big Z, Mariusz and Brian, and to all that took part.

Second, I have heard and been in many debates to which is the greatest strongman of all time, and was lucky to watch the first WSM.

But it boils down to two men at this moment in time, Mariusz or Big Z ????? I am a fan of both, but am far bigger Mariusz fan. However if both had a contest against just each other every weekend, with different events each time, I would say at the end of a year it would be equal or so close as they both deserve so much respect, as no real strongman fan should say ether is the better as they both have their strengths and weaknesses.

But let’s look at some facts, on only these two men.

Mariusz tore his biceps in March, and was not back to full training until July, thus with a torn biceps and only three full months before the WSM he did himself and fans more than proud, absolutely amassing the strength and shape he got himself into in that short amount of time he had, HOW DID HE DO IT.

Mariusz is 38kg or 86 pounds or 6 stone lighter than Big Z, to put that into respective, Mariusz is roughly 140kg or 308 pounds or 22 stone you would have to find a man 102kg or 224 pounds or 16 stone, that could keep up and beat and lose with a very small margin, I can tell you for FACT, this will NEVER happen.

1,
F.F.
What can you say about Big Z, he blew the W.R. away totally amazing. However Mariusz, again done far better than last year, beating his old time by many seconds, and milly seconds for beating Derek.

2,
F.W.
After seeing Derek do the famers at F. I thought Mariusz would not beat him in this event, however he beat all by 6 seconds, he ran {pun intended} away with this event, jaw dropping. And no one could say it was light.

3,
T.T.P.
This one got me, as we all know Mariusz is about the best truck pulled out there, I was dumfounded how he did so bad, however seeing the pull you could see it needed great bodyweight to get it started. And then there was only 1 second between the times of six men, wow. So maybe Mariusz, but as you all say, no excuses, true.

Biz Z pulled like a draft horse.

4,
A.A.
If I had to bet, I would have gone for in this order, Big Z, Derek, and Mariusz. However when I seen Mariusz power cleaning every one, which takes real strength, and then just giving it a small jerk and up they all went, he showed me something that did could never have wished for, he showed more strength than he did before, cannot believe he did this. I think if he had rested 2 more seconds before the last one, he would have got it, and drawn with Big Z, but NO excuses.

I really loved that event, as hearing the huge weight come crashing down, and not many times you see Big Z totally pushed to his limit and failing in the press.

Big Z, Derek, Mariusz, WOW totally World class pressing, imagine meeting them three in a dark ally.

5,
B.P.
Here is where Mariusz shows he has more power than Big Z, and dynamic strength, power is the rate at which work is performed or energy is converted. Big Z, done very badly, and was lucky to finish. Brian well what can I say ??????

6,
D.L.
After Big Zs very long pull in theB.P. Thought his back and whole body would not have been up to this, and as Mariusz as always beat him in the past thought it was easy going to be Mariusz event. But then seen Big Z had the WR for pulling so and so weight for reps, thus I started to worry, but still thought it was going to be Mariusz, what can I say, Big Z showed them all.

7,
This was nail biting stuff, and you could see Mariusz would have won other than for his height, but that’s an excuse aggh, and you said no excuses, but then I am a Mariusz fan ROL.

I know a lot of you Derek fans will be down for a long time, but remember in his very short time we can see he is going to be one of the best. However the funny thing is that I am disappointed, but not really, as with Mariusz torn biceps { excuse again, but I think that is a real excuse } and only three months full training, he did a 120% or more, and blew me away more than the time he won.

It’s funny how some here did not like or respect Mariusz, but that happens in all sports. A long time ago a Spanish bodybuilder type was in the WSM, he did not do to well, and some of my friends put him down, but I did not, as he must have trained very hard to get to where he did, We should all respect all strongmen.

It’s great to see a lot have said very good words about Mariusz. And when he raised Big Zs hand, a big show of camaraderie. Another thing, Big Z and Mariusz do not bother with nitpicking and being on forums like this, they make and take strongman very differently, they are more like very strict professionals in the army, only after the competitions do they celebrate, and the winner and loser gets so much respect. As it says on Mariusz site, Big Z is WSM for this year.

Big Z has beaten Mariusz 3 times in a major competition, and Mariusz has beaten Big Z 6 times. However I think they are both the top two Worlds Strongest Men, they are equal, but if some want to think one or the other that’s up to them, as if you’re a Mariusz fan you would say Mariusz, if Big Z you will say Big Z.

But as I named this thread; Mariusz and Biz Z, Worlds Strongest Men At “This” Moment In Time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strongman_Super_Series

I salute ALL the strongmen that took part in WMS. Sorry if I did not mention you all, as its long enough as it is.

[J. Alexander]

Hulk would smash.


Seriously. End of discussion.

[Daniel Dase]

Hmm, without trying to get into a big drawn out arguement, I believe that Zydrunas Savickas is a much better, and well rounded strongman when compared to Mariusz.

The reason I think this is, if you changed around the events like you suggested, it would be hard to find events where Mariusz would beat Savickas more times than the other way around.

Imagine if we did the same events as when Kazmaier was champion. Max squat, max deadlift, max loglift, 56lb weight for height, bar bend, front hold for time, keg loading, truck pull without a rope, and sumo wrestling. Couldn't even imagine Mariusz keeping pace with Savickas in a contest like that.

Also.. I think that would be a good idea for a super series contest.. to hold the same events from when Kaz was champion, it's not very often we see more than one max lift at a contest nowadays.

[Paul E Ohl]

Very good first post John. And a good piece of research.

I would suggest that you dig in a little more and have a peak at the history of a competition that favored the "heavier " events and called: World Muscle Power, an idea promoted by Dr Doug Edmunds and held for quite a while, first in Scotland. Jon Pall Sigmarsson being a 5-time winner of that competition.

Also, it would be fair to take into account the numerous competitions held under IFSA rules between 2005 and 2008 where Zydrunas reigned in absolute fashion. That would represent some 30 + international competitions with standardized implements.

Finally, it would be full circle by adding the Arnold's stats ( 2002-2009).

Anyway, good job.

[Adrian Kimmett]

http://mynews.ctv.ca/mediadetails/1492190?collection=742&offset=4&siteT=


This has to be the most weight ever moved by a single person and the largest object as well. Add that to the other multiple world records he holds and I think you could make a pretty strong argument for this man as well.

[Patrick McGuffin]

Is this the same John Evens that has several Guinness world records for balancing things on his head? Like you know, cars...

As far as this thread I really think it is a toss up and whoever has a better day will lose. Mariusz is faster and Z has more brute strength. Boil it all dawn and the are basically even unless things get a lot lighter or a lot heavier.

[Matt Schumann]

This is a very respectable post. I am definitely pro Poundstone and I was pulling for him to win but it wasn't meant to be this year. I think experiences like this is what propels athletes to become champions.

I do have to question the severity of mariiuszs bicep pull. At first I know it was reported as a torn bicep but shortly after it was reported that it was not as severe as first reported. I'm not questioning mariuszs performance by any means I just wanted to find out what the case was with his bicep.

Where do these 3 athletes go from here? Will we see them compete at the Arnold or Fortissimus. Another wsm? Or is mariusz retiring?

[Wolfgang Hasenmaier]

Mariusz is the most successful athlete in the contest "World`s strongest man". Far better built for the bodybuilding crowd. Agreed. A ton of warrior spirit. Yes. An amazing champion.

But when it comes to lifting max weight (ahem max strength, isn`t it?) he is not even in the same league as the big Z. So "if" Mariusz decided to add another 50 lbs of muscle? So what "if" Franco Columbu adds 1 foot or 50 lbs in muscle in 1975 and threatens Arnie`s throne? Ifs mean nothing as well. Facts mean everything.

Biggest max strength in most events = strongest maximum strength. By virtue of that the big Z dwarfs Mariusz. As simple as that: 19 world records.


There is a video that proves it in a little more than 2 min.

http://www.youtube.com/user/ISCLLondon09#play/all

[Adrian Kimmett]

Pudz is going to be fighting in MMA, maybe Big Z should too so can have them fight it out and settle who is the most dominant man once and for all in the cage? Dana White should put this together in the UFC, tell me that wouldn't do record sales on Pay Per View.

[Patrick McGuffin]

This has gone on far to much, we have over 5 threads about the exact same thing going on right now. move this to one of the other threads.

[Tony Moses]

Actually, my vote is for Kimbo Slice.

[Paul F.X. Armstrong]

Actually, my vote is for Kimbo Slice.



I have to respectfully disagree...strongest man to ever live?

It's obvious..."The High Plains metal Iron master ... boy...when I play...I play heavy"

Steve Justa...you want proof?
here's a 1900lb, 1/4" range of motion squat
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Xua4NOs2bc

"just send me 20 dollars"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Xua4NOs2bc

Man that song is a cross between Texas Chain Saw Massacre and Deliverance---still gives me the willies.

[Kevin Cronin]

I do have to question the severity of mariiuszs bicep pull. At first I know it was reported as a torn bicep but shortly after it was reported that it was not as severe as first reported. I'm not questioning mariuszs performance by any means I just wanted to find out what the case was with his bicep.

The one from this year? Somebody posted pics of the surgery. That thing is 100% legit, no two ways about it. Really interesting, i guess in the US a bicep repair is a laparoscopic procedure whereas in europe it's open (this is conjecture, not certain of this.) Result being that most north americans who have their biceps done are left witha few dots, maybe a zipper scar. the europeans, not exactly.

I commented last year that Oli's scar looked liek someone had operated on him with a kitchen knife (pretty bad mod edit, actually). Well Mariusz' looked WAY worse. I said it looked like a dog had chewed on it, someone else said that it looked like they'd operated with a chainsaw.

So the point of this is, either Mariusz had a legit surgery on his bicep, or he went to the trouble of hiring a better-than-hollywood makeup artist to make it look that way.

[Daniel Dase]

I have to respectfully disagree...strongest man to ever live?

It's obvious..."The High Plains metal Iron master boy...when I play...I play heavy"

Steve Justa...you want proof?
here's a 1900lb, 1/4" range of motion squat
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Xua4NOs2bc

"just send me 20 dollars"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Xua4NOs2bc

Man that song is a cross between Texas Chain Saw Massacre and Deliverance---still gives me the willies.

God, I can't help but laugh, and be a bit scared/creeped out everytime I hear his song.

[LouFatski]

None of these "Big Z" discussions would be taking place if Mariusz had won this year. Mariusz has different strengths than Z and vice versa.

[JustinLallemand]

Adding in pound for pound just makes the whole thing to complicated. Niam Suleymangolu (pretty sure I butchered that name) would probably be most peoples vote for tops. Pound for pound he can snatch more than most people could squat or deadlift. Overall I would say savikas for sure though.

Yeah, we are simply asking STRONGEST, period.

I think you could make the claim even more legit by having him powerlift raw. With his shoulders and tris, it can't be that rediculous to think he could hit a 700 raw bench.

And we've seen his deadlifting...

I think (and there's no way to get everyone to agree, simply impossible) that he is the strongest person that has ever been well documented. Then you still have other things like era's, etc. I'd put Kaz way up there, even though his era didn't have all of the "tools" (I refer to everything, not just one area of chemestry, lol). So in a way, I'm already starting to contradict myself a bit by making qualifications.

Ultimately, I'd say for simply "STRENGTH" - not power as may be measured in oly lifting that requires a tremendous amount of power and technique as well as strength - that strongman and unequipped powerlifting would be the two best tests.

I think most everyone would say he is AT LEAST argueably the strongest strongman ever witnessed. So in my mind, that leaves him to test powerlifting. If he were to train for say 6 months and walk in and destroy all raw records for any weight class, one would never be able to convince me that he is not.

So many variables and circumstances make this impossible to quantify, so it really is a judgement call. But considering what he has done after having torn two patella's at once, he is simply superhuman in my mind....just as you might say Stephen Hawking is almost superhuman (but I won't even try to compare with other physicists...he has the benefit of being widely known as well).

Sucks, but you wont find an answer to this definitively. But given a bunch of assumptions, you might be able to get close.

It's an interesting question that comes up a lot with Kaz also. I use "strongest, period" but that doesn't mean I wouldn't love to be able to see what Kaz could do in this era.

(So, a lot of rambling, assumptions, etc.....but no answer, lol. I'm good at that.)

[JustinLallemand]

None of these "Big Z" discussions would be taking place if Mariusz had won this year. Mariusz has different strengths than Z and vice versa.

Oh yeah, then you could have an argument for strength endurance. With two main variables, that makes it even that much more difficult to define.

[LouFatski]

Oh yeah, then you could have an argument for strength endurance. With two main variables, that makes it even that much more difficult to define.

An example of strength endurance is rowing a heavy boat for long periods of time or long distances. Both men are strong in different ways. The trouble is different people have different ideas of what the definition of strength is.

If I can lift 300 lbs. once and you can lift it 3 times, you are stonger than I am.

If I can lift 300 lbs. and walk 5 feet with it and you can lift 300 lbs. and walk 25 feet with it, you are stronger than I am.

If I can bench 300 lbs. once and you can do 325 once, you are stonger than I am.

No man has ever dominated WSM like Pudzianowski did, literally leaving competitors in the dust. Z won this year so hats off to him. If he wins 5 more he will be the best "World's Strongest Man" ever.

[Garrick Daft]

Congratulations to Zydrunas and all... it was a ferocious battle of the strengths of mind, body, and soul... absolutely amazing.
http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/5243/kazz.jpg
http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/8661/mpzj.jpg

[Kevin Cronin]

None of these "Big Z" discussions would be taking place if Mariusz had won this year. Mariusz has different strengths than Z and vice versa.

And nobody would be calling Elizabeth II "queen" IF she had testicles.

[JEFF VANCO]

Big Z is the champion of champions

[LouFatski]

Congratulations to Zydrunas and all... it was a ferocious battle of the strengths of mind, body, and soul... absolutely amazing.

http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/8661/mpzj.jpg

Awesome shot of both Z and Marius.

Pudz needs to put on 40+ lbs. to compete next year.

[Tony Christopher]

Wesley,

There are several problems with your argument here.

First, NO ONE is ever going to carry 385 pounds of lean bodyweight. The heart, lungs and remainder of the cardiovascular system can't support that much lean muscle. Guys like Pudz are about as big as a person can get. Savickas probably carries about as much lean muscle weight under all the fat as Pudz does ... somewhere in the vicinity of 300 pounds.

Frankly, without "the unmentionable" ... the human body has a really tough time building and holding even 300 pounds of lean bodyweight ... much less close to 400.

That aside, the big problem I've always had with the "pound for pound" argument is that it rewards people for having really short limbs (and hence better mechanical advantage) AND it rewards people for trimming bodyfat rather than getting stronger. Both of these things for me, run counter to the spirit of strength athletics.

The only reason Naim Sule-don't-know-how-to-spell-it (Pocket Hercules) can handle the weights he does at his bodyweight is because his limbs are tremendously short. Now, I don't dispute his strength, but I think it's an overstatement to say that he's stronger than a SHW lifter who must lift with longer limbs.

Moreover, when guys start to say "Well, I currently squat 600 at 250, but if I trim down to 200 and hit 500, that will be a better ratio" that to me is completely counter to the spirit of being a strength athlete. It ignores the fact that you just got 100lbs WEAKER than you were before.


I'm a little guy so maybe you have validity, but doesn't EVERYONE view strength this way, otherwise, why would their be weight classes in strongman, powerlifting, boxing, etc... It could just be a free for all, like an open meet, then no one "little" would enter since they wouldn't have a chance to win, and the only people considered strong are those 400lbs genetically.

I agree Z is awesome, but my whole point is hypothetically speaking, say you take Mariusk and pack on him 50 pounds of muscle, since he is all muscle versus Z who is fluffy as I believe Easton put it LOL. Maybe Ill take heat for this, but hands down Id put my life savings that Pudz would destroy him at 385 lean bodyweight in EVERY EVENT. Or what if Z lost 50lb of anything?? Could he compete like he does now, I doubt it.

One thing is, you guys are right, probably not worth hypotheticals (hard to stay away from) but I just wanted to explain a point of view. I know some of you agree, others will disagree, but either way look at all perspectives of it. So many variables, height, weight, bodyfat, etc, etc..

Z won this year so he has the title and right to call himself the Worlds Strongest Man as the title suggests. :)

[Tony Christopher]

Can't agree more ... Mark PROBABLY had the potential to be a strength legend right up there with Kaz, Z, Pudz etc.

However, he elected to take a much larger pro-wrestling pay check instead.

Can't say that I really blame him ... but you can't have you cake and eat it too.

He elected to get paid instead of compete, so he can't expect to be called a legend.

I'm sure if Mariusz could destroy Z at WSM weighing 385lbs lean, he'd do it. Some guys are just not built to be that big, and it would be detrimental/ impossible to get to that size and compete. You can't' hypothetical' anything here, cause it just hasn't, and won't happen. One could argue Mark Henry stood a chance of having a better record than Z... but fact is, he didn't, and potential doesn't mean jack if it isn't used.

[Ryan Wells]

I'm a little guy so maybe you have validity, but doesn't EVERYONE view strength this way
I'm sorry, but no they don't. Why do you think there isn't a show on ESPN with little guys lifting heavy stuff? Flame me if you want, but that's the reason why you will NEVER see "world's strongest light weight" or strength sports with weight classes on prime time television. That's just the way it is. I believe that there are weight classes in sports like that for reasons of equality.

IMO, of course.

[LouFatski]

"world's strongest light weight" or strength sports with weight classes on prime time television. That's just the way it is.

dude, priceless.

[jay lyttle]

i've said it before, but here it goes "people go to the circus to see the ELEPHANTS not the ANTS"!

[Jay Hagadorn]

"Fat does not flex".
-Svend Karlsen
With that said, Zydrunas is not fat. Strength is not dependent on weight (although if you are big enough, you will have a better chance of being stronger.)
Overall the strongest men are usually the biggest. I would reconsider the attitude some of you fatties are portraying though. I know Wesley is stronger than some of you guys at half your body weight!
:M:

[LouFatski]

"Fat does not flex".
-Svend Karlsen
With that said, Zydrunas is not fat. Strength is not dependent on weight (although if you are big enough, you will have a better chance of being stronger.)
Overall the strongest men are usually the biggest. I would reconsider the attitude some of you fatties are portraying though. I know Wesley is stronger than some of you guys at half your body weight!
:M:

Translation: Z's body fat percentage is obviously much higher than Pudz' :)

[Jay Hagadorn]

Translation: Z's body fat percentage is obviously much higher than Pudz' :)

And Zydrunas just proved he was "faster, stronger, with greater endurance and fatter than Mariusz...again."

[Jonathan Macfarlane]

I'm sorry, but no they don't. Why do you think there isn't a show on ESPN with little guys lifting heavy stuff?

IMO, of course.

Lol dude... excellent. I'm sending a PM to our resident photoshopper to make a pic of this... if anyone wants to make a poster for a "Worlds strongest pound for pound little guy lifting big stuff contest" or the like, go ahead.

[Patrick McGuffin]

I would reconsider the attitude some of you fatties are portraying though. I know Wesley is stronger than some of you guys at half your body weight!
:M:

I retract any feelings of love that I have claimed for you mister Hagadorn.:EP:

[Patrick McGuffin]

Lol dude... excellent. I'm sending a PM to our resident photoshopper to make a pic of this... if anyone wants to make a poster for a "Worlds strongest pound for pound little guy lifting big stuff contest" or the like, go ahead.

If I wasnt at work I would be all over that like stripes on a tiger.

[LouFatski]

And Zydrunas just proved he was "faster, stronger, with greater endurance and fatter than Mariusz...again."

Can't wait to see it on ESPN. I never doubted Z's power.

[Matt Schumann]

man I was totally wrong. I remembering reading something that said that his injury wasn't as bad as it first looked and that was the last that I heard about it. All the power and respect to the man for performing like he did coming off of such a serious sugery.

Hopefully the big 3 will have more battles before they retire.

The one from this year? Somebody posted pics of the surgery. That thing is 100% legit, no two ways about it. Really interesting, i guess in the US a bicep repair is a laparoscopic procedure whereas in europe it's open (this is conjecture, not certain of this.) Result being that most north americans who have their biceps done are left witha few dots, maybe a zipper scar. the europeans, not exactly.

I commented last year that Oli's scar looked liek someone had operated on him with a kitchen knife (pretty bad mod edit, actually). Well Mariusz' looked WAY worse. I said it looked like a dog had chewed on it, someone else said that it looked like they'd operated with a chainsaw.

So the point of this is, either Mariusz had a legit surgery on his bicep, or he went to the trouble of hiring a better-than-hollywood makeup artist to make it look that way.

[Ernest Ballard Beath]

Savickas competed with the heavy events at the arnold....and won...

Savickas went to where the weights are lighter and more mobility is involved at WSM...and won..

I think that pretty much sums it up...


Why does it always turn into a weight and looks deal? I am one of those close to 400lbrs...and if i went down to 320 or whatever, there is no way i would look like mariusz...bones, ligaments, genetics,etc..have too much to do with it..i would look like a smaller me...same way as i wouldnt look like poundstone...Why worry about twisting it around and talking about well savickas weighs this and lifted this and its this percent...bottom line is he has won BOTH big strongman contests, one known for speed and one known for brute strength...not even talking about fortimus...a 400lbr beat someone that is "ripped and pretty" in a contest that many said couldnt be done by him...Bottom line.

[BradyJones]

Can't agree more ... Mark PROBABLY had the potential to be a strength legend right up there with Kaz, Z, Pudz etc.

However, he elected to take a much larger pro-wrestling pay check instead.

Can't say that I really blame him ... but you can't have you cake and eat it too.

He elected to get paid instead of compete, so he can't expect to be called a legend.

are you even familiar with mark's accomplishments?? highest sq EVER, top 3 highest raw totals ever, one of the highest raw dls ever, american oly records, arnold winner.. and many more

[JustinLallemand]

Man, Mark Henry....he always makes me think of this dude in my HS that had limitless potential. Henry has shown his immense strength...but this guy I knew took gym class but just sat around and everyone knew you couldn't get him to do anything.

One guy made him mad and he threw on 600lbs and deadlifted it easy. The other dude, who was pretty strong for a highschooler and played football in college and was our best lineman when I was a freshman couldn't budge it and looked pretty embarassed.

The other thing was, this guy was also quick as hell at around 6'5" and 350. Not only tall but he had a massive frame.... Sorta makes me feel bad that he never did anything with it and to be perfectly honest, I wished I could DL 600 the first time I tried, lol.

He and his younger brother were both like that and neither one played football in college but I guarantee both could have played D-I.

Mark Henry is somehow considered almost lazy, but he most definitely wasn't/isn't. I bet he'd still be extremely competitve if he trained hard for a contest. He was also an accomplished oly lifter that started later than most (I think this is the case).

Makes you wonder how many guys with awesome genetics just didn't apply it...but it really doesn't mean a thing if that's the case. Work is of as much importance and probably more....but you really have to have all pieces going.

(Oh, and these brothers were both smart on top of it....but for some reason, incredibly lazy - at least when it came to the things I witnessed. My football coach was so frustrated he couldn't get the older brother to play, while the younger one would miss summer camps and lifting. For 2 years, he'd lose his starting position b/c of that, only to get it back by the middle of our first game both years, lol.)

[Matt Dawson]

Awesome shot of both Z and Marius.

Pudz needs to put on 40+ lbs. to compete next year.

this is a silly comment. What do you mean he needs to put on 40lbs to "compete." It came down to the last event, Mariusz took second. wtf?

[Tony Moses]

I wouldn't call Mark Henry a lazy waste of potential by any means, lol. He competed in the Olympics, has numerous accomplishments in PL, and won the Arnold. He went to the WWF/E and made millions. To me, at least, he is a pretty accomplished, successful guy.

Sure, it's a little disappointing from strength fan's perspective because he likely would've done more in strongman, but his strength resume is fuller than just most people's will ever be. Also, if people think there is no money in Strongman now, there was even less when Henry went the wrestling route. He got some notoriety from the olympics and he capitalized on it. If he was used better in wrestling, and had the status of a Steve Autin or a HHH, then I think people would tend not to think of it as such a waste for him.

Either way, he still accomplished more than most people ever will in strength competitions, and while I don't know him, I can take a pretty good guess that when he balances his checkbook he is working with 8 figures.

[Kevin Cronin]

I wouldn't call Mark Henry a lazy waste of potential by any means, lol. He competed in the Olympics, has numerous accomplishments in PL, and won the Arnold. He went to the WWF/E and made millions. To me, at least, he is a pretty accomplished, successful guy.

Sure, it's a little disappointing from strength fan's perspective because he likely would've done more in strongman, but his strength resume is fuller than just most people's will ever be. Also, if people think there is no money in Strongman now, there was even less when Henry went the wrestling route. He got some notoriety from the olympics and he capitalized on it. If he was used better in wrestling, and had the status of a Steve Autin or a HHH, then I think people would tend not to think of it as such a waste for him.

Either way, he still accomplished more than most people ever will in strength competitions, and while I don't know him, I can take a pretty good guess that when he balances his checkbook he is working with 8 figures.

cosigned (im not so sure he has tens of millions, but everything else)

[LouFatski]

this is a silly comment. What do you mean he needs to put on 40lbs to "compete." It came down to the last event, Mariusz took second. wtf?

And it will be a repeat if Mariusz doesn't bulk up.

:BP:

[Buller Mackay]

Now I am not saying Big Z is not the best of recent times or at least for the last 20 odd years, even in line with mark Henry, but to consider them the strongest of all time, I would err to think not its not all just lb for lb it certainly has a great deal to do with genetics, will power desire and self belief; if an individual has all of these plus the means in which to show them off he should be definitely considered as the strongest man of all time, I don’t think there are many people who would qualify but if you were 5’8” and weighed 360lb with obvious leverage benefits and qualified in all the above categories and lived today would that person surely not be the strongest man of all time. I think in that respect the accolade should surely go to Louis Cyr, challenge people at there own specialty and win, win enough and loose, well maybe a little and no one could argue.

Ben Weider seemed to think so, as do many other authoritative articles!

Big Z has it today and speculation will undoubtedly continue! He has genetics on his side and that will be hard to beat..

BM

[Tony Christopher]

Brady,

Mark won the Arnold strongman once ... defeating Svend Karlssen ... a fine accomplishment, but hardly enough to call him a strength legend (when stacked up against Z who has won it, what ... 6 times, and guys like Pudz, Kaz, MVM, JPS and others who have won WSM multiple times.)

He holds the record for the highest raw squat ever ... an incredible accomplishment. Probably his best single claim to being the strongest ever ... but in my book a record on 1 of the 3 powerlifts does not make you a legend.

Best deadlift I can find for Mark is 903.9. Huge weight ... but 11th on the all time list (according to powerliftingwatch). Not the stuff of legends either (and I did a little research that shows Bolton and a few others have done more than 903.9 raw, in case you feel I'm not comparing apples to apples).

Raw total records in powerlifting ... I see Don Reinhoudt's name, not Mark's ... 2,391 with knee wraps, 2,298 without any gear whatsoever (except, I assume, a weight belt). Has Mark done more? I'm not aware of it.

Olympic lifting ... sorry, American records don't make you a legend (and I think Shane Hamman surpassed Mark's American records anyway, hasn't he?) When Mark went to the Olympics he got his clock cleaned ... didn't even come close to getting a medal.

Bottom line ... Mark is/was an incredibly strong guy with all the potential in the world. He also has a "very good" strength resume ... but legendary ... hardly.

There are at least a dozen guys (and probably more) who have accomplished more than Mark in strongman and powerlifting and hundreds who have surpassed him in olympic weightlifting.


are you even familiar with mark's accomplishments?? highest sq EVER, top 3 highest raw totals ever, one of the highest raw dls ever, american oly records, arnold winner.. and many more

[Kevin Cronin]

Defining "legend" appears to be as ambiguous as defining "strength"

[Steve Dohoney]

I wouldn't call Mark Henry a lazy waste of potential by any means, lol. He competed in the Olympics, has numerous accomplishments in PL, and won the Arnold. He went to the WWF/E and made millions. To me, at least, he is a pretty accomplished, successful guy.

Sure, it's a little disappointing from strength fan's perspective because he likely would've done more in strongman, but his strength resume is fuller than just most people's will ever be. Also, if people think there is no money in Strongman now, there was even less when Henry went the wrestling route. He got some notoriety from the olympics and he capitalized on it. If he was used better in wrestling, and had the status of a Steve Autin or a HHH, then I think people would tend not to think of it as such a waste for him.

Either way, he still accomplished more than most people ever will in strength competitions, and while I don't know him, I can take a pretty good guess that when he balances his checkbook he is working with 8 figures.

I think the porblem is that he got really really fat.....

[Brandon Smith]

My head hurts trying to follow the 10 threads about what if Mariusz gained 40 lbs, could he defeat a radioactive Zydrunas, a cyborg Paul Anderson, a zombie JPS, Mark Henry before he got rich and fat, and Kaz wearing some sort of titanium squat suit if it was contested in a controlled setting with standardized equipment on the bottom of the ocean floor. This is all starting to sound like a SNL skit:

"Bob Swerski: Now what if Da Bears were to enter the Indianapolis 500? Uhhh, what would you predict would be the outcome, huh?

Todd O'Conner: How would they compete?

Bob Swerski: Well, let's say they rode together in a big bus.

Carl Wollarski: Is Ditka driving?

Bob Swerski: Of course.

Carl Wollarski: Then I like Da Bears! "

Besides, we all know that Chuck Norris only needs to think about becoming the strongest person in the world and every other strongman/powerlifter/olympic lifter will explode...that's why he doesn't.

[jay lyttle]

i dont think its a must that you have to compete to be a legend, i trained with a kid back in the 70's who was clearly the strongest person i'd ever seen.[600 bench, 650 full squat,700+ dead, 120lb. db curls etc.] worked out in his work clothes, barely spoke to anyone! i couldnt get that guy to compete to save my life, he just wasnt interested. but i'll tell you he was a legend in that gym and the city he lived in. that being said, mark henry won the arnold once and never competed in a strongman event again mainly due to the fact that he was under contract to the WWE and mcmahon wouldnt let him. he won the arnold, went to the olympics, had a great pwerlifting total, good enuff for me. ask people that were at the ASB dinner when he bitch slapped the thomas inch dumbell, so easy in fact that KAZ'S jaw hit the floor. henry's a freak! and given the freedom to compete he would have numerous titles to his name NO DOUBT! you can argue who is the strongest man that ever lived forever, but you'll never win that argument, its to tufff to call, different eras. events, supplements, etc. to much plays into choosing 1! [plus we all know that the strongest man who ever lived is KAZ! :B:

[Craig Pfisterer]

What if Mariusz gained 40 lbs, could he defeat a radioactive Zydrunas, a cyborg Paul Anderson, a zombie JPS, Mark Henry before he got rich and fat, and Kaz wearing some sort of titanium squat suit if it was contested in a controlled setting with standardized equipment on the bottom of the ocean floor.Well, I guess I have a project to work on this weekend...

[BradyJones]

Brady,

Mark won the Arnold strongman once ... defeating Svend Karlssen ... a fine accomplishment, but hardly enough to call him a strength legend (when stacked up against Z who has won it, what ... 6 times, and guys like Pudz, Kaz, MVM, JPS and others who have won WSM multiple times.)

He holds the record for the highest raw squat ever ... an incredible accomplishment. Probably his best single claim to being the strongest ever ... but in my book a record on 1 of the 3 powerlifts does not make you a legend.

Best deadlift I can find for Mark is 903.9. Huge weight ... but 11th on the all time list (according to powerliftingwatch). Not the stuff of legends either (and I did a little research that shows Bolton and a few others have done more than 903.9 raw, in case you feel I'm not comparing apples to apples).

Raw total records in powerlifting ... I see Don Reinhoudt's name, not Mark's ... 2,391 with knee wraps, 2,298 without any gear whatsoever (except, I assume, a weight belt). Has Mark done more? I'm not aware of it.

Olympic lifting ... sorry, American records don't make you a legend (and I think Shane Hamman surpassed Mark's American records anyway, hasn't he?) When Mark went to the Olympics he got his clock cleaned ... didn't even come close to getting a medal.

Bottom line ... Mark is/was an incredibly strong guy with all the potential in the world. He also has a "very good" strength resume ... but legendary ... hardly.

There are at least a dozen guys (and probably more) who have accomplished more than Mark in strongman and powerlifting and hundreds who have surpassed him in olympic weightlifting.


that dl is one of the highest raw dl's ever.. top 5 i believe, some of the others wore suits, like vlad and benni...

his raw total was 2339 in a tested powerlifting meet in 1996. dozens of guys that have passed him in powerlifting, where are you getting that from??

first man to also ever officially clean and press the inch, and reported to snatch it, not official though. also speaking of grip 2nd man to fully deadlift the circus, id say pretty good

he didnt get close to a medal because he got injured, lol, had nothing to do with his clock getting cleaned... he had a 200/240 in plan for olympics until his back was injured on his 2nd snatch attempt.

as far as the oly lifting yes he wasnt a legend, but a trip to the olympics, pan american medals, a few american records, not to bad as far as great accomplishments go, thats definetely one to make note of.

[Brandon Smith]

Well, I guess I have a project to work on this weekend...

I was hoping if I threw that one out there, you'd step up Craig! :marv:

[Tony Christopher]

Brady (and others),

I'm not disputing that Mark is/was a very strong guy. All I'm saying is that he doesn't have the same credentials as a number of other "legends" because he chose not to fully pursue a strength career. Instead he chose to take the $$$ and become a pro wrestler.

It's all well and good to say someone had "200/240 in plan for the Olympics" but he didn't deliver, did he? I'm sure Derek, Pudz and a host of others had "winning WSM 2009 in plan" but they weren't able to deliver. Not that there's anything wrong with that ... everyone loses once in awhile ... that's fine assuming that the person comes back the next time and delivers (or has delivered in the past). Mark never did.

He has some huge powerlifts to his credit, one very impressive strong man competition victory, and some good (though not outstanding) olympic lifting numbers.

Strong ... absolutely. Proven among the strongest ever ... not in my book (of course, you're free to disagree and debate ... that's where the fun is).

Cheers,

Tony

that dl is one of the highest raw dl's ever.. top 5 i believe, some of the others wore suits, like vlad and benni...

his raw total was 2339 in a tested powerlifting meet in 1996. dozens of guys that have passed him in powerlifting, where are you getting that from??

first man to also ever officially clean and press the inch, and reported to snatch it, not official though. also speaking of grip 2nd man to fully deadlift the circus, id say pretty good

he didnt get close to a medal because he got injured, lol, had nothing to do with his clock getting cleaned... he had a 200/240 in plan for olympics until his back was injured on his 2nd snatch attempt.

as far as the oly lifting yes he wasnt a legend, but a trip to the olympics, pan american medals, a few american records, not to bad as far as great accomplishments go, thats definetely one to make note of.

[BradyJones]

Brady (and others),

I'm not disputing that Mark is/was a very strong guy. All I'm saying is that he doesn't have the same credentials as a number of other "legends" because he chose not to fully pursue a strength career. Instead he chose to take the $$$ and become a pro wrestler.

It's all well and good to say someone had "200/240 in plan for the Olympics" but he didn't deliver, did he? I'm sure Derek, Pudz and a host of others had "winning WSM 2009 in plan" but they weren't able to deliver. Not that there's anything wrong with that ... everyone loses once in awhile ... that's fine assuming that the person comes back the next time and delivers (or has delivered in the past). Mark never did.

He has some huge powerlifts to his credit, one very impressive strong man competition victory, and some good (though not outstanding) olympic lifting numbers.

Strong ... absolutely. Proven among the strongest ever ... not in my book (of course, you're free to disagree and debate ... that's where the fun is).

Cheers,

Tony


true, he wasnt able to deliver in the olympics, but the other accomplishments in my opinion make him one of the strongest.

[Buller Mackay]

I think the term legend should not be used where a high percentage of factual and provable details exist,

Hercules was a legend

The person may have existed but their feet’s may go unsupported (no pun intended)

OD Wilson (the Nightmare) I would have thought should have been considered, had it not been for a running race in 1990 he would have been WSM, not many people can have a giant keg land on them after it falling approximately 10’ and just walk away:

•also a Squat 1029 at the USPF Nationals late 80s cant be sniffed at
•A comment on WSM by KAZ stating OD was breaking records he had set years before

"There is nobody stronger than me. Nobody... nobody. I'm the strongest man on this planet." OD Wilson

The Kaz & OD American pairing looked awesome (pure Strength)

Consider this:
A strong man has an accident, 30 stone becomes 18, as he losses his legs, he benches 605raw does that make him now lb for lb the strongest man that ever lived?

senario:- your livelihood as a farmer is to plough a field, you could go for the lb for lb strength of an ant or take a horse (hypothetically) I know which one I would choose.
In the realms of reality the more you lift the more consideration you should have in being the strongest man of all time..

Debate for eternity or until time folds back on itself

BM

[Paul E Ohl]

The question will definitely not be answered soon. It will be up to the historians of Strength to bridge past and present with as many documented facts as possible and to some physiologists and biomechanical engineers to come up with enough criterias so that we can have a scientific POV of ultimate human strength.

At present, the question about Zydrunas Savickas being or not the Strongest Man tha Ever Lived will remain unanswered.

However, the question as to who is the Strongest Man Alive can be answered: it is ZYDRUNAS SAVICKAS.

Comparing Zydrunas' accomplishments with any other Strength Athlete competing or having competed in the sport of Strongman during the past four decades there is no doubt whatsover.

1. Zydrunas has competed for half of his life in Strongman ( 17 years over 34 years).

2. Zydrunas has the most registered Strongman competitions on record: 132

3. Zydrunas has the best ratio of podiums : 112/132 with 72 first places

4. Zydrunas has the most impressive track record with regard to WR per events ( 9 different events)

5. Zydrunas is the only Strongman who bettered WR by more than 10 % in less than 5 years: i.e. in the Log from 412 lbs to 463 lbs ( 12,5 % in 5 years, as it previously took 15 years to better the record by 8,5 %. Same witth the Apollon Axle, by 13 % in 5 years.

6. Zydrunas is the only Strongman who handled Natural Stones from 350 lbs to 450 lbs in less than 19 secs;who handled the Arnold's Stones ( 525 lbs x 3 reps); who managed WR in Super Yoke on any distances between 7 meters to 30 meters ; who held at one point or another in time all WR in Strongman DL ( either Hummer, Regular, Sigmarsson Wheels, Car DL); the only Strongman to hold all One-Arm Dumbbell lifts ranging from 150 lbs to 225 lbs single or medley, not to mention his most recent Fingal's Fingers at 2009 WSM in 27 secs, etc.

7. Zydrunas is the only Strongman to have won ALL MAJOR STRONGMAN CHAMPIONSHIPS, plus a World Champion Super Series title in 2005. That in itself should suffice to give him the edge.

Concluding this by : Zydrunas Savickas is by any standards one of the three Strongest Man that Ever Lived ; the Strongest Man of the modern era, and the Strongest Man on Earth alive.

[Steve Dohoney]

Ritalin is to ADD as Paul is to this thread.

[Paul E Ohl]

Steve I couldn't get the prescrition at the required dosage. Maybe you could get me some in Waterbury.

Let me add that this is now the city of the Strongest Cop in the World...but you already know that.

Google map will add this at short notice.

Good news is that this post was my conclusion.

[Dennis Ruygrok]

Hey Paul,

I'm a little curious as to where you located a couple of your stats? I vivdly recall watching Savikas competing in '98 in a strongman team comp saying that it was one of his first strongman competitions. It was also the first year he competed in WSM.

[Steve Dohoney]

Steve I couldn't get the prescrition at the required dosage. Maybe you could get me some in Waterbury.

Let me add that this is now the city of the Strongest Cop in the World...but you already know that.

Google map will add this at short notice.

Good news is that this post was my conclusion.


No! I mean that in a good way, meaning you bring it back to topic.

[Jonathan Macfarlane]

true, he wasnt able to deliver in the olympics, but the other accomplishments in my opinion make him one of the strongest.

A New Zealander has oly lifted more than him. I think clean and jerking 485lbs is a good achievement, but there are 17yr old Eastern European kids that have lifted that much. It doesn't really count for much IMO.

Misha trumps Henry in my book, and he's not even gettin a mention in this thread.

[Kalle Beck]

A New Zealander has oly lifted more than him. I think clean and jerking 485lbs is a good achievement, but there are 17yr old Eastern European kids that have lifted that much. It doesn't really count for much IMO.

Misha trumps Henry in my book, and he's not even gettin a mention in this thread.

I mentioned him.

I don't think anyone has better overall achievements in the three power sports than Misha

[Paul E Ohl]

Steve it was meant to be an inside joke !!!!

Thanks anyway for the hint.

All all the best to the great fans of strongman in Waterbury.

[Paul E Ohl]

Dennis, have a peak at the following and consider that although it is a fantastic job done by Garrick Daft, Zydrunas said he will see that it gets completed later.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zydrunas_Savickas

[JimmyHerbst]

Now I am not saying Big Z is not the best of recent times or at least for the last 20 odd years, even in line with mark Henry, but to consider them the strongest of all time, I would err to think not its not all just lb for lb it certainly has a great deal to do with genetics, will power desire and self belief; if an individual has all of these plus the means in which to show them off he should be definitely considered as the strongest man of all time, I don’t think there are many people who would qualify but if you were 5’8” and weighed 360lb with obvious leverage benefits and qualified in all the above categories and lived today would that person surely not be the strongest man of all time. I think in that respect the accolade should surely go to Louis Cyr, challenge people at there own specialty and win, win enough and loose, well maybe a little and no one could argue.

Ben Weider seemed to think so, as do many other authoritative articles!

Big Z has it today and speculation will undoubtedly continue! He has genetics on his side and that will be hard to beat..

BM

That sounds like Serge Redding!

[Grant Buhr]

That Wikipedia article may need to be brushed up a bit.

Worlds Strongest Man - Quebec, Canada - winner (9/24-25/2005)

Hm.

[John Evans]

I wish whatever mod moved this thread to here would please move it back, as I did not want to chat about Zydrunas Savickas = Strongest Man Who's Ever Lived, I wanted to chat about, Mariusz and Biz Z, Worlds Strongest Men At “This” Moment In Time. And now lots of what I wrote has been lost and not answered, and it took me quite some time to write.



Very good first post John. And a good piece of research.

Thx Paul.

Not so much research, just from my own head.

I would suggest that you dig in a little more and have a peak at the history of a competition that favored the "heavier " events and called: World Muscle Power, an idea promoted by Dr Doug Edmunds and held for quite a while, first in Scotland. Jon Pall Sigmarsson being a 5-time winner of that competition.

Yes I remember World Muscle Power well. But I do not think that Bill Kazmaier or Jon Pall Sigmarsson, would have had a very hard time to make it past the qualifiers to the finals in the last ten or more years.

Both their log lifts max’s {370 pounds roughly} were very low to what all the modern day strongman do, and their log rep maxs was with quite light weights. They also took a very long time to lift the light set of stones, and most of the time they could not lift the last stone. And just image Mark Henry at this year’s contest at the slightly lighter Apollon’s Wheels, he may have got it up 5 times if he was lucky, as his best with the slightly heaver Apollon's Wheels was 3 reps. However I do not want to talk about these to greats.


Also, it would be fair to take into account the numerous competitions held under IFSA rules between 2005 and 2008 where Zydrunas reigned in absolute fashion. That would represent some 30 + international competitions with standardized implements.

Hmm, suppose your right, but Mariusz has also entered many competitions, and won many of them 99%, most people your side of the pond do not even know he has entered these competitions. He entered three before this year’s WSM, after his tore biceps was healed this year, won 2 and lost one. He lost to fellow countryman Robert, and when Robert gets his pressing power up a bit, he will be one to watch.

Finally, it would be full circle by adding the Arnold's stats ( 2002-2009).

Anyway, good job.

Dammed how could I forget the Arnolds, yes Mariusz entered three times, and Big Z beat him on each occasion, this its Mariusz 6 Big Z 6 cool.

I am even more glad I named my thread, Mariusz and Biz Z, Worlds Strongest Men At “This” Moment In Time.


Anybody see the candid photos on Roberts site ????? Did you see the one of Mariusz stripped to his underpants in his room, totally awesome and amassing, tell you what, whoever you think is the all round strongest, I can tell you one thing, Mariusz looks a 100% better than Big Z, and I would rather look like Mariusz, by a huge margin, however this is not a bodybuilding competition.


Lets take two events, Big Z can RM Mariusz out in the log lift, however Mariusz has the WR for the carrying of the stone, think its 150M, and maybe he could have gone on to 200m, This in my book is a show of POWER beyond what I ever thought possible. A 420 pound log lift of 10 seconds, might look stronger to some, but from a "pure power" “pure force” “pure explosive strength” and all round “pure strength” aspect it pales in the comparison to walking with a 400 pound stone for 75 seconds.

[Paul F.X. Armstrong]

The question will definitely not be answered soon. It will be up to the historians of Strength to bridge past and present with as many documented facts as possible and to some physiologists and biomechanical engineers to come up with enough criterias so that we can have a scientific POV of ultimate human strength.

At present, the question about Zydrunas Savickas being or not the Strongest Man tha Ever Lived will remain unanswered.

However, the question as to who is the Strongest Man Alive can be answered: it is ZYDRUNAS SAVICKAS.





We are all getting a little wordy here :o but it seems to be a good natured discussion.
I have to go along with whay Paul has said.
The winning of the WSM,heads up with marius, was definitely a big victory-

I will add that I would like to see him take another shot at powerlifting--he is much stronger now-bigger and perhaps even more explosive--his 2400 Total done when he wasn't as big or as strong and i believe he weighed 50lbs less-

I'd like to se him either raw or single ply(IPF rules) go after a big total.
I think part of kaz's reputation was his great powerlifting totals-World Champion Powerlifter-it may have meant less to the public(although being announced as a World Champion Powerlifter can't be ignored) but it adds to his reputation as history evaluates him-
It seems within the realm of Possibility-?-that Z with specialization could go over 2600-?-he's bigger and stronger in every lift he does-I think with some real specialization he could do this-
I'd think this would be "The Cherry on Top"of his career-it would make it difficult for non-strongmen(other lifters) to argue about his 'strength' and as the years went by such a total would add to the historical significance of his career

-As far as Mark henry in this hypothetical Strongest man Alive-? or Strongest man to ever live I think we often base this on his potential--what he could have done-what some fans think he 'should'have done --not --if you look closely at what he has actually done in COMPETITIONS-not what he has actually accomplished in the strength and power sports

--Henry is incredibly strong -may have more natural ability than anyone-but his one win in a Strongman contest at The Arnold in 2002 (against Pfister and Svend who were just 6 days out from a tough 2 day contest in Boston) was, IMO, less impressive than it outwardly appears
--Henry ,who's mentor is Terry Todd (the person that I believe organized and initiated the Arnold Strongman concept )was preparing for the contest specifically with similar implements(there is an article on the Internet out there somewhere actually quoting henry on his work with a specially built "frame" carry device)
Phil and Svend--although experienced strongmen and competitors---basically had no idea what was going on and were beat up from the previous weekend of competeing

Mark was first with 25 points
Svend 2nd 22.5
Pfister 3rd 21.5
Phillipi 4th 20 points(i don't recall if Phillipi did the Boston show the week before)

(BTW I believe Karl Gillingham actually won that Strongman contest in boston that previous w/e but I may have my wires crossed)

Pro Strongmen have done "back to back" shows--it can be done --- but this one--the Arnold format- IMO-Phil,Svend and Mark Phillipi weren't ready for it-Andy Bolton- of course- probably didn't prepare either

As i understand it Phil and Svend really didn't even know exactly what the events were--and they took the contest on relatively short notice

You can use the old argument that "it's strongman and be ready for anything" but IMO it's different when you have to compete against one athlete that is specifically training for the events and the Arnold Format and if you as an athlete are not-

-Today when the pro's are getting ready for the Arnold they train differently from the other contests they prepare for--often gain weight--train heavier--less cardio--and i don't think anyone in today's strongman community-- if they were invited to the Arnold-- is going to do a tough,2 day contest just 6 days before the contest-?

Henry won the first Arnold (his first and only strongman win)fair and square--and he is a true freak specimen of strength but as a "strongman"-?-that one win in one contest can't compare to what Zydrunas has done--not even close

Not saying Svend,Phil or Phillipi would have beat henry--but their lack of preparation and not being 100% recovered from the Boston contest may have changed the outcome of Mark henry's only strongman victory--or at least--as close as the contest was--it could have been closer if they had prepared--as Mark Henry did--and if they hadn't competed the previous weekend-?-

Henry's Olympic lifts weren't very impressive at an international level at all-period-and although he definitely had a great Squat and deadlift his 500lb bench isn't really much for such a massive man-?-
If you argue that he didn't specialize the bench-or he has long arms-?- i can think of three ,tall,long armed kids that signed free Agency contracts in the NFL this year that were well over 500lbs--and did not specilaize in the bench press either --
-
-not to mention many smaller powerlifters and also strongmen that hit 500+on the bench--add to that several bodybuilders also;)
I feel bench press is part of the strength equation and he isn't very good at it-some will say bench doesn't matter--but we all have opinions on this lift

The best Olympic lifts I've seen reported on Henry were a 396lb snatch and a 446.6 C&J-

I've seen 485 thrown around but I don't recall where or when that lift occurred.
And-?-What place would that get you in the Olympics @165 or 181 or 198's--?-with those lifts-?
it's strong but not world class.



Henry may have had the potential ,perhaps,to become the strongest man on earth--or the strongest man in History but i don't think the sum of his actual accomplishments add up to this title

[Garrick Daft]

That Wikipedia article may need to be brushed up a bit.

Worlds Strongest Man - Quebec, Canada - winner (9/24-25/2005)

Hm.

Wiki-punks at work... hard to keep them at bay. They junk up everything, feel free to change whatever you see wrong or revert it back to an older version, as I don't have time to keep up with these kids who trash everything for whatever pathetic reason they have to do it. Of course this used to say IFSA World Championships...

[BradyJones]

W

Henry's Olympic lifts weren't very impressive at an international level at all-period-and although he definitely had a great Squat and deadlift his 500lb bench isn't really much for such a massive man-?-
If you argue that he didn't specialize the bench-or he has long arms-?- i can think of three ,tall,long armed kids that signed free Agency contracts in the NFL this year that were well over 500lbs--and did not specilaize in the bench press either --
-
-not to mention many smaller powerlifters and also strongmen that hit 500+on the bench--add to that several bodybuilders also;)
I feel bench press is part of the strength equation and he isn't very good at it-some will say bench doesn't matter--but we all have opinions on this lift

The best Olympic lifts I've seen reported on Henry were a 396lb snatch and a 446.6 C&J-

I've seen 485 thrown around but I don't recall where or when that lift occurred.



henry has done an official 584 raw bench in a full texas powerlifting meet in the early 90's, best oly total was right before olympics, 180/220 he went, theres a vid clip of that out there.

[Paul F.X. Armstrong]

henry has done an official 584 raw bench in a full texas powerlifting meet in the early 90's, best oly total was right before olympics, 180/220 he went, theres a vid clip of that out there.

My mistake ther brady--i just remember a 501 bench and the 446 C& J

584 bench much better than i thought he did --for a 420 pounder though thats like doing a few push ups:p j/k

[Mike Landrich]

Anybody see the candid photos on Roberts site ????? Did you see the one of Mariusz stripped to his underpants in his room, totally awesome and amassing, tell you what, whoever you think is the all round strongest, I can tell you one thing, Mariusz looks a 100% better than Big Z, and I would rather look like Mariusz, by a huge margin,

That is disturbing in many ways. Strongest vs looks and you choose looks on a Strongman site:BB:

[Brandon Smith]

That is disturbing in many ways. Strongest vs looks and you choose looks on a Strongman site:BB:
Are we getting some crossover with http://bearmythology.net/about/ or something? :BB:

[Paul F.X. Armstrong]

--Henry ,who's mentor is Terry Todd (the person that I believe organized and initiated the Arnold Strongman concept )was preparing for the contest specifically with similar implements(there is an article on the Internet out there somewhere actually quoting henry on his work with a specially built "frame" carry device)
Phil and Svend--although experienced strongmen and competitors---basically had no idea what was going on and were beat up from the previous weekend of competeing

Mark was first with 25 points
Svend 2nd 22.5
Pfister 3rd 21.5
Phillipi 4th 20 points(i don't recall if Phillipi did the Boston show the week before)
Pro Strongmen have done "back to back" shows--it can be done --- but this one--the Arnold format- IMO-Phil,Svend and Mark Phillipi weren't ready for it-Andy Bolton- of course- probably didn't prepare either

As i understand it Phil and Svend really didn't even know exactly what the events were--and they took the contest on relatively short notice




Excerpt from Iron Game history,Vol 7.#2,#2




The only one of the athletes I saw train during the run-up to the event was, of course, Mark Henry, and I watched him each week as he would load a rectangular metal apparatus he’d had made (at a machine shop). Each week he’d load it with more and more weight and carry it up a ramp at the Varsity Weight Room at the University of Texas in Austin. Although he had never done a Farmer’s Walk event, and had only tried once to carry two objects (he carried two plate-loaded metal racks that day weighing 365 pounds each up a slight hill for a distance of approximately 50 feet and said he could have gone further), I suspected that because of his overall body power and strength of grip he should be able to meet this challenge if he had enough time to practice. Watching him get stronger gave me the confidence to suggest that a weight of eight hundred pounds would not be asking the men to do the impossible. I realized, of course, that an apparatus made out of thick logs or timbers would be more cumbersome and difficult to balance than the small metal rectangle Mark was using in practice. Even so, I thought that when the Hummer was on the line most of the men would be able to carry eight hundred pounds at least part of the way up the ramp. I was joined in this assessment by several of our contestants, including Svend Karlsen, who thought eight hundred pounds sounded about right. As for my own vote on the weight of the timber apparatus, I chose to stick with eight hundred pounds even though I suspected that an even heavier weight would have been a truer test of brute strength. I opted for the lighter load because I wanted all the men to have a good shot at carrying the timbers all the way to the top. I discussed this with David and Kaz and they both agreed that we should try our very best to load the men so that most of them could finish the course.

Finally, a father and son team of carpenters in Lockhart, Texas began to build the apparatus about a month before the event, after I had at last located some old timbers, and they finished just a few days before the apparatus had to be loaded onto a flatbed trailer and hauled up to Columbus. But before we loaded it, I asked Mark to come to the small town where it was built and try to lift and carry it. Even though it could be argued that by doing this I was giving Mark an advantage over the other contestants I felt we had to be certain that the apparatus could be lifted, balanced, and carried up a slight grade. I discussed this with David and Kaz and they concurred. We had to learn if the much more massive load of timbers would create problems for Mark and, by extension, the other competitors. And whom could I ask if not Mark? If there was a problem with the apparatus we needed to know it, so the problem could either be fixed before the actual contest or so we’d know we had to use a smaller, plate-loading metal frame instead of that brutal load of timbers. In any case, Mark drove down and it was good that he did, as he bent the braces the carpenters had used to hold the carrying bars in place. He predicted after looking the apparatus over that the braces would bend, but the carpenters said they wouldn’t. The braces did bend when he lifted it, however, but new and larger braces were installed and the new braces held when Mark raised it off the shop floor for the second time. Encouraged, we loaded the bolted-together pile of timbers onto a trailer, drove it a couple of miles to the parking lot of a nearby grocery store, and unloaded it. Quickly, so as not to draw a crowd and perhaps be stopped by the store managers, Mark (already warm by having lifted the apparatus a few times while the bracings and balance were being checked out) stepped inside the timbers, chalked his hands, took his grip, lifted the timbers, and carried them up a grade fairly comfortably for about thirty-five feet. This was impressive to see, of course, but what really made Jan and I happy was that the apparatus appeared to balance well and, even more important, was definitely not so heavy as to be un-liftable. So we reloaded the apparatus, wrapped it securely with a tarp, tied it in place, and the next day two of my neighbors — Josh Kosarek and Pat Hall — drove off toward Columbus, along with the disassembled “light” version of Apollon’s Wheels.

The night before the contest began — during the tour all the contestants were given to view the implements and the places where they’d be lifted, pushed, and carried — the men saw for the first time the daunting pile of timbers for themselves. They were asked if they’d like to lift it, but understandably no one stepped forward on the night before the contest was to begin. Even so, after being assured that the timbers weighed “only” about 815-825 pounds, and that Mark had had one successful “test-flight” with them, the men collectively decided they could be lifted. They did make a group request to have the apparatus placed on blocks for each man so it wouldn’t be necessary to squat down so far to lift the apparatus before carrying it up the ramp. The officials accepted that request.

One more quote from the article

We were certain of one thing, which was that by using one solid implement instead of two unconnected implements we would be making the event different — and this would help to insure that the “strongman” contestants with years of experience in the Farmer’s Walk would lose a bit of their “training” advantage.

Ironic because Phil 'smoked'the frame event and beat henry-- but the article written by Dr. Terry Todd)dramatizes that the contest wasn't meant to favor a Pro strongman-----but somebody was practicing:confused:

[Pierre Suter]

Long thread. I would vote for Z but think that the top dogs in olympic lifting are about on par with Zydrunas. For example, Rezazadeh is a full step above Misha K in terms of brute strength, much like Z is, so you have to rank Rez and Z pretty close. Then you have Taranenko whose 586 clean and jerk record has stood for 25 years despite tens of thousands of lifters since then being selected and trained for that event. Even Z with his amazing overhead strength would be hard pressed to put 586 overhead from the front let alone clean it. Still, I would vote for Z based on strongman being a better overall test than OL.

[Tyler Shelgren]

[QUOTE=John Evans;291771]
Both their log lifts max’s {370 pounds roughly} were very low to what all the modern day strongman do, and their log rep maxs was with quite light weights. They also took a very long time to lift the light set of stones, and most of the time they could not lift the last stone.

I dont know man, Kaz had the strictest press I have ever seen, Watching a few videos he had no leg drive at all, and (sorry, I hate being the hypothetical guy) if he trained the Log regularly he would have a much different outcome then 370LB, WHICH BY THE WAY IS STILL BADASS FOR ANYONE :IMHO: and I am pretty sure none of them trained stones either, at least not often, wasn't jouko ahola the first to regularly train events anyways, Thus concludes the longest run-on sentence ever.

[LouFatski]

Lets take two events, Big Z can RM Mariusz out in the log lift, however Mariusz has the WR for the carrying of the stone, think its 150M, and maybe he could have gone on to 200m, This in my book is a show of POWER beyond what I ever thought possible. A 420 pound log lift of 10 seconds, might look stronger to some, but from a "pure power" “pure force” “pure explosive strength” and all round “pure strength” aspect it pales in the comparison to walking with a 400 pound stone for 75 seconds.

Exactly, it's life and death to push that hard.

[Mike Landrich]

Exactly, it's life and death to push that hard.

Strength is absolute, as is power, and is expressed as max weight over a short period of time. Endurance is something entirely different. If a 400 stone for 75 seconds is impressive (expressed as a numerical value of weight vs time, 3000), is a 300 stone for 2 minutes (3600), or 220 stone for 3 minutes (3960) more impressive? Easy answer no, but, using your logic, endurance trumps brute strength.

I guess I can sum it up this easily. You will attempt to find ways to justify your support of a certain athlete, and that is your prerogative. But, please don't try to convince the rest of us by using pseudo-intellectual justifications.

[LouFatski]

Strength is absolute, as is power, and is expressed as max weight over a short period of time. Endurance is something entirely different. If a 400 stone for 75 seconds is impressive (expressed as a numerical value of weight vs time, 3000), is a 300 stone for 2 minutes (3600), or 220 stone for 3 minutes (3960) more impressive? Easy answer no, but, using your logic, endurance trumps brute strength.

I guess I can sum it up this easily. You will attempt to find ways to justify your support of a certain athlete, and that is your prerogative. But, please don't try to convince the rest of us by using pseudo-intellectual justifications.

Force = Mass x Acceleration

Strength is the capacity for exertion or endurance. Strength applies to the quality or property of a person that makes possible the exertion of force or the withstanding of strain or pressure.

Power, a physical might and mental or moral efficacy, is the ability to act or produce an effect. It's the rate at which work is performed or energy is transmitted, or the amount of energy required or expended for a given unit of time.

[Jonathan Macfarlane]

Do I have this right?

Zydrunas has won a really heavy show 6 times.

He won another really heavy show this year in Canada.

Then WSM, which some people seem to think is really light and suited for smaller guys... against the best field ever assembled, he won as well.

And now people want to haggle over the fact that he doesn't look good in a speedo. Either way, he's doing something right.

How about we give him a hall pass?

This place is turning into bb.com with some of the stupid comments getting thrown around. I'm tempted to turn every 2nd thread into an anchorman quote fest.

[Chris Weaver]

Both their log lifts max’s {370 pounds roughly} were very low to what all the modern day strongman do, and their log rep maxs was with quite light weights. They also took a very long time to lift the light set of stones, and most of the time they could not lift the last stone. And just image Mark Henry at this year’s contest at the slightly lighter Apollon’s Wheels, he may have got it up 5 times if he was lucky, as his best with the slightly heaver Apollon's Wheels was 3 reps. However I do not want to talk about these to greats.


I can't let this go...lol Just playing devil's advocate as far as Kaz and Jon Pall:

Neither had the information available now (internet), neither had the access to training implements like there is now, most (if not all) of the log presses were with true wooden logs, which are substantially harder to press then metal ones. Also, I don't believe they used tacky on the stones, maybe some type of resin, but from watching the old videos, I don't think they used anything. A 240, 280, 300, 320, 340 series without tacky is pretty impressive.

Also, back then, there seemed to be quite a bit more variety in strongman events. There was bar bending, sumo wrestling, sack loading, fridge running, tire tossing, caber, weight for height, etc. Nowadays it seems like its overhead press, some type of deadlift, farmers, stone, and maybe a yoke or keg race. I don't think that's necessarilly a bad thing, but the events definitly are more standardized nowadays.

[LouFatski]

Do I have this right?

Zydrunas has won a really heavy show 6 times.

He won another really heavy show this year in Canada.

Then WSM, which some people seem to think is really light and suited for smaller guys... against the best field ever assembled, he won as well.

And now people want to haggle over the fact that he doesn't look good in a speedo. Either way, he's doing something right.

How about we give him a hall pass?

This place is turning into bb.com with some of the stupid comments getting thrown around. I'm tempted to turn every 2nd thread into an anchorman quote fest.

LOL, you right.

[LouFatski]

Z is the king now, period. I still think Pudz might come back next year bigger, better, stronger, scarier than ever to not only work to beat big Z but also to win his 6th WSM title.

:F:

[RyanWilson]

Are we getting some crossover with http://bearmythology.net/about/ or something? :BB:

You seem to be forgetting, Bears would most likely find Big Z to be much more adorable and cuddly for those long winter nights in front of the fireplace. :D

This place is turning into bb.com with some of the stupid comments getting thrown around. I'm tempted to turn every 2nd thread into an anchorman quote fest.

I think we need a new direction. How about, whose father could beat up the other one, Pudz' dad or Big Z's? Let the debate begin!

[Patrick McGuffin]

You seem to be forgetting, Bears would most likely find Big Z to be much more adorable and cuddly for those long winter nights in front of the fireplace. :D



I think we need a new direction. How about, whose father could beat up the other one, Pudz' dad or Big Z's? Let the debate begin!

My dad would beat everyone's dad. The end.

I said the end so there cant be any debate, that's the rule!

[Jonathan Macfarlane]

My mother could beat up your dad.

[Jean-Charles Péronnet]

Roger Ortmayer owns many of your dads.

[Patrick McGuffin]

My mother could beat up your dad.

Woah, lets leave the mothers out of this, no need for things to get hostile.


I too have a mother, and Marshall White is afraid of her.

[Chris Hartschuh]

Dorothy Mantooth is a saint!

Just for you Jono. :LOL: :D

[John Evans]

None of these "Big Z" discussions would be taking place if Mariusz had won this year. Mariusz has different strengths than Z and vice versa.

Well said.

And Zydrunas just proved he was "faster, stronger, with greater endurance and fatter than Mariusz...again."

Where was he faster with greater endurance and explosive strength ????? Watch the first stone.

http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?hl=en&sl=pl&u=http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3Du1MHQRGef5s&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dhttp://szczepanski.net.%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG&rurl=translate.google.com&usg=ALkJrhgI_KOp1-ZV59LVWVYC_ZZEUZ3FZg


You can plainly see Mariusz lose on the stones ONLY because of his height, however that’s an excuse, and at the end of the day Big Z, won, cool, and Mariusz went back and lifted his arm in honour.

I think a lot here of Derek’s fans should be saying more on Derek, as I know will be feeling down at this time, I was not a Derek fan, but am now, and even before I still knew in his short time he is one of the best.

Could I ask Derek’s girlfriend something please, as over a year ago Derek was not too happy with a few things Mariusz did at M. But she said this year he was very helpful all week, how please.

I also think a lot here are making this more than it is. As I am sure Big Z and Mariusz do not, as they know how good each other are, and respect each other.

Also Big Z is never going to get the recognition he deserves, as 99.9% have never heard of A. Or F. And take last night when I was out having a few beers, I was with a few friends that also like strongman, bodybuilding and power lifting, so I said would you like to know who won this year’s WSM, they all said, ok, bet it was Mariusz, I said no it was Big Z.

Then they all stated saying, but it should have been Mariusz, he’s the best ever, and {remember these are into strongman and bodybuilding} he’s got the best body in the world, Big Z is just big and fat. I then tried to tell them a little, but even that Mariusz came second, they went on and on about how Mariusz was the best ever for about an hour, not even mention Big Z. Point is Mariusz is known to most as the best there is, he has been and still will be WSM for several years to come, too just about everyone that’s not a hard core strongman fan, and that’s just about everyone in the world.

Have to say one more thing, I can’t wait to see the farmers walk, and Mariusz nearly drawing with Big Z on the axel, after the biceps tore, makes me feel fantastic, ho nearly forgot the boat pull, only friendly teasing there guys ROLOTF.

[Craig Pfisterer]

Lol dude... excellent. I'm sending a PM to our resident photoshopper to make a pic of this... if anyone wants to make a poster for a "Worlds strongest pound for pound little guy lifting big stuff contest" or the like, go ahead.
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a41/bmoviebuff/Other%20Stuff/epwsmwinvbbslhortb.jpg

[Will Sanderson]

Where was he faster with greater endurance and explosive strength ????? Watch the first stone.

http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?hl=en&sl=pl&u=http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3Du1MHQRGef5s&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dhttp://szczepanski.net.%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG&rurl=translate.google.com&usg=ALkJrhgI_KOp1-ZV59LVWVYC_ZZEUZ3FZg


You can plainly see Mariusz lose on the stones ONLY because of his height, however that’s an excuse, and at the end of the day Big Z, won, cool, and Mariusz went back and lifted his arm in honour.


youre wrong. mariusz clearly made a false start and Z still beat him. he lost on the stones because he wasnt as fast as Z on the day. simple as.

[Paul E Ohl]

Just an opinion. I watched this Youtube 6 times. Two things:

1. TV interference as always. Why don't they make their close takes BEFORE the ref calls the athletes to their starting positions ?

2. Under written rules ( that should be sent to the competitors at least one month prior to their arrival), the athlete cannot JUMP START the whistle. At the international level, there is NO FALSE START CALL BACK ( ONE WARNING THEN DISQUALIFIED) in Strongman. Whoever is guilty gets a 2 to 5 secs penalty.

In this case, NO call, NO penalty. Yet Mariusz did jump start the whistle...and lost by over 2 secs.

[Mike Westerling]

Wow! That was video was awesome!
Thanks for posting it,
-Mike

[J. Alexander]

http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?hl=en&sl=pl&u=http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3Du1MHQRGef5s&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dhttp://szczepanski.net.%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG&rurl=translate.google.com&usg=ALkJrhgI_KOp1-ZV59LVWVYC_ZZEUZ3FZg


You can plainly see Mariusz lose on the stones ONLY because of his height, however that’s an excuse, and at the end of the day Big Z, won, cool, and Mariusz went back and lifted his arm in honour.



Hahahaha....you're dreamin' dude. Even with the blatant false start, he still lost. It wasn't height that beat him, it was strength and speed from Big Z.

It wasn't Mariuz's day that day. Big Z is the WSM, until he is beaten next year, or the year after. Just deal with it...:)

[LouFatski]

youre wrong. mariusz clearly made a false start and Z still beat him. he lost on the stones because he wasnt as fast as Z on the day. simple as.

I love Z but listen man, when it comes to height you can't bullshit me about events like stones and fingers.

[LouFatski]

Hahahaha....you're dreamin' dude. Even with the blatant false start, he still lost. It wasn't height that beat him, it was strength and speed from Big Z.

It wasn't Mariuz's day that day. Big Z is the WSM, until he is beaten next year, or the year after. Just deal with it...:)

You can clearly see Mariusz' reflexes are insanely fast. They could have whistled and it would have hardly changed a thing as Marius is too short for the height of the platforms. He gets it up fast but has to play with it because he can't drop it and 6-1" is not short.

[Paul E Ohl]

These platforms are standard height from the looks. First one at 1m72, give or take 1 cm.

Nothing to do with height as a significant factor to explain this or that.

There are 2 inches between Mariusz and Z. It is not as if you had Mariusz vs Brian Shaw, Terry Hollands or Phil Pfister.

Look at the way the 4th stone is put up by both men. And especially the 5th stone. Strength is the difference in that last stone. period.

[RyanWilson]

Marius' lack of proper height must account for why he never won WSM before, or any contest involving stone heights above the waist ;)

Let's get beyond the "he lost because he's not as tall" schtick. He's beaten taller men than Z, so what point is there even in mentioning height at all here?

Dude didn't get 1st fair and square - Z was the better man that day, anything else to be said to make excuses is just sour grapes. Excuse-making is only taking away from the fact he got 2nd, which is incredible in itself. Why cheapen the honor in that? If Pudz isn't here making excuses in person, then perhaps even he knows better than to do so and realizes that you can't be the best man every time. Let's put this thing to bed, and wait for 2010 to see what comes about.

[Mike Landrich]

Let's get beyond the "he lost because he's not as tall" schtick. He's beaten taller men than Z, so what point is there even in mentioning height at all here?



Easy answer. Because they need to defend their intense man-crushes. :EL:

[LouFatski]

These platforms are standard height from the looks. First one at 1m72, give or take 1 cm.

Nothing to do with height as a significant factor to explain this or that.

There are 2 inches between Mariusz and Z. It is not as if you had Mariusz vs Brian Shaw, Terry Hollands or Phil Pfister.

Look at the way the 4th stone is put up by both men. And especially the 5th stone. Strength is the difference in that last stone. period.

If Z's platforms were 2 inches higher would he have gotten the same time? Height is definitely a factor in this sport.

[Paul E Ohl]

Lou, if Z's platforms would have been 2" higher what would have Mariusz done ?

Height is NOT a definite factor in that sport, I must disagree.

What the taller athletes gain in leverage at some events they lose in others, ie in the Overhead for one.

Phil Pfister was the last strength athlete of over 6'4" to have won a WSM contest.

Please consider Ahola, Taylor, Svend, and of course Mariusz. They did not bother about height and size for that matter.

[WesleyInman]

Height is NOT a definite factor in that sport, I must disagree.


I respectfully disagree to some level with this.

Why would Darren Sadler wear "elevator" boots when he does stones, or some of the other shorter athletes?? Being short has it's disadvantages in many events.

Thats not to say being short doesn't have advantages, because it absolutely does leverage wise IMO. But lets say for discussion sake that 4 out of 5 events are suited towards a taller athlete, car pulls, stones, fingers, etc....Doesn't that favor a 6'5 athlete over a 5'9 athlete, lending a hand in winning??

Also, everyone keeps saying Pudz is 6'1 tall...I have never measured him personally but meeting him in person many times, I would say he's 5'10-5'11" at most...just pointing that out, anyone else agree to this??

[Jay Hagadorn]

Arild Haugen is very short. Don't tell him height is a disadvantage, he might get so psyched out he won't be able to load anymore.

[Paul E Ohl]

Wesley, a sample research done 4 years ago revealed that the average strength athlete having participated in WSM since 1977 was 6'2 i/2" at a bodyweight of 314 lbs.

The sample accounted for 60 competitors.

The IFSA has standardized the platforms for the Atlas Stones for sure starting in 1999 ( WSM in Malta, first edition). The first platform at 172 cm ( around 5'8"). And that is pretty well the guide for all international Strongman competitions. Now what has changed is the respective weights of the Stones. Back in Jon Pall and Bill Kaz's years there were 4 stones, the 4th one slightly over 300 lbs. Now we have at least 5 stones, the 5th one over 400 lbs.
We had 6 at Fortissimus, the 6th one at 425 lbs. Plus a run of Natural Stones on day 2 between 350 and 530 lbs.

As for the events giving an edge to the taller guys ( 6'4" and up), I agree that Pulls and Finger's will see them perform better. Sometimes not always.

At any rate, the selection of the events does take that element into account. And for that matter, if WSM would just add a couple of events to the finals ( and re-shape their qualifiers) we wouldn't have this discussion.

[Paul E Ohl]

Jay, Arild Haugen is 1m90 ( 6'2" ) at 135 kg ( 297 lbs) in 2007. He competed at 2008 Fortissimus at some 310 lbs . And the same year came up with that fantastic run at the Stones at WSM.

What psyched him out was not height or mass but the poor pay that came out of Strongman !!!

[Patrick McGuffin]

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/HNTxr2NJHa0&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/HNTxr2NJHa0&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

Thats what I think of this thread.....

[Mike Landrich]

I respectfully disagree to some level with this.

Why would Darren Sadler wear "elevator" boots when he does stones, or some of the other shorter athletes?? Being short has it's disadvantages in many events.

Thats not to say being short doesn't have advantages, because it absolutely does leverage wise IMO. But lets say for discussion sake that 4 out of 5 events are suited towards a taller athlete, car pulls, stones, fingers, etc....Doesn't that favor a 6'5 athlete over a 5'9 athlete, lending a hand in winning??

Also, everyone keeps saying Pudz is 6'1 tall...I have never measured him personally but meeting him in person many times, I would say he's 5'10-5'11" at most...just pointing that out, anyone else agree to this??


Wesley
I agree about height being an advantage in stones, to a point, but using Darren Sadler as an example is extremely misleading. He is so much shorter than most other competitors.
As for height lending an overall advantage, that is true in almost all sports. Taller golfers have longer arcs to their swings, taller tennis players have a steeper angle at which to serve the ball, Zdeno Chara of the NHL has an advantage in stick length and reach. Powerlifting is one of the few exceptions, but they also have weight classes. If PLing didn't have them, the 6'+ SHWs would still dominate in absolute weight handled. To argue against the height argument, I will say that "shorter" athletes should just stay in the LW class and then they could be the tall guys.
I think I heard Marius was 180 cm tall, which is 5'11", I believe.

[LouFatski]

Arild Haugen is very short. Don't tell him height is a disadvantage, he might get so psyched out he won't be able to load anymore.

Just because you're tall doesn't mean you're a stronger stone lifter. But when it comes down to two equally strong "stoners" the taller man has the advantage.

[RyanWilson]

Just because you're tall doesn't mean you're a stronger stone lifter. But when it comes down to two equally strong "stoners" the taller man has the advantage.

Perhaps one man happened to be stronger that day than the other one, which is why he came out the winner.

These weren't 90" platforms for all the stones, and if we wanted to be completely accurate, you'd have to measure all limbs on competitors to find approximate leverages to find who had any advantage over the other. Why not email Z and Pudz to ask them to give out their precise arm, leg and torso measurements if you want to get overly picky about it. Maybe the difference is that Z has a longer neck and you'll find out that the extra 2" didn't make any difference at all. Maybe he has a giant head. Who knows, and frankly, who should care, because the game is over and we know who won in 2009, 2" height difference or not ;)

Like I said before, Pudz got 2nd, which is fantastic. I'm sure he wishes he got 1st, but there's no shame in not being on top every single time. I'm sure he'll be training to try and get that top spot back again - I don't see the man as dwelling on excuses, rather, he's at the top of his game because he'll come back better than before when he needs to step up his game. Perhaps a few people here could learn from that attitude rather than defending the honor of a man who needs no defense and lets his actions speak for themselves.

We're not comparing a dwarf to Herman Munster here for the difference in stone loading performance. I'm not saying another thing to keep this going, because obviously, some people aren't ready to accept that Z won by being the better man that day as he was stronger and faster than everyone else when it counted most. No idea why this is so hard to accept, but that's the fact, whether or not people choose to believe it.

[Paul F.X. Armstrong]

I think there are advantages and disadvantages caused by height,arm length and other leverage factors created throughout the course of a strongman contest for each individual strongman-

I haven't heard many complaints from the Tall guys but,now, on the opposite end of the sectrum, Taller athletes have further to pull the bar on the deadlift--there are a lot of good tall deadlifters-- in fact many of the worlds best have been tall(Gary heisey 921 record stood for a long time--was 6'7")but the longer the pull the longer it takes to move the bar-
On deadlift for maximum reps this 'could'
be a disadvantage as the bar must travel futher distance each rep-you could even argue they have to expend more energy to complete each rep-?-

Clean and Press of the log or axle or even dumbbells--again the taller athletes have to pull the bar/log/dumbbell higher for the clean,moving the weight a longer distance--and then push the bar further for the lock out--'could'be a disadvantage for tall or very long armed guys on clean and press for reps-?-as they are moving it further for both aspects of the movement

Shaw,Pfister,Conner,Ostlund at the finish of their press lock out end up with the bar near the 10 ft basketball rim:p

You could say the taller guys are at a disadvantage on the farmers walk because they have so much further to move on the pick up but at the same time,hypothetically,they can take longer strides as they are moving

You could look at each event and outwardly each event would seem to favor a certain body type?

I think over the course of the contest the various events and leverage factors created by the athlete's height or size will sort itself out--and the strongest man,that day,will win.

I believe the shortest Worlds Strongest man is Gary Taylor @ 5' 11" and Pudz.at 5' 11",I've met former WSM Ahola and he is listed at 6' 1"( i thought he was closer to about 6')-- and the tallest WSM have been Ted Vandepar at 6' 11",Magnus Samuelson at 6'7" and Phil Pfister at 6' 6"-
Ahola at 6' or 6' 1" was defintely one of the best stone lifters of his era also.


Now the year Stumpy Raines(5' 6")competed @ WSM he may have been at a disadvantage on the stones;)

[Tony Moses]

The tall platform is the lightest stone though. I would think everyone in the contest could push press that stone right over the platform if they wanted to, and then as the stones get heavier, the platforms get shorter to the point where unless you're a midget, the last two stones are about how strong you are.

I thought Mariusz was 5'11. My honest, non-bull crapped height is 5'11 barefoot. I met Mariusz when he was signing autographs at a supplement store a few years back and got a pic with him. We both had on sneakers and in the pic we're both the same height, so I always figured him at 5'11". When I played sports back in the day I was listed anywhere from 6' to 6'2 1/2", lol.

[J. Alexander]

I think over the course of the contest the various events and leverage factors created by the athlete's height or size will sort itself out--and the strongest man,that day,will win.


I agree, and I like to think that's really the point of a well put together contest. Some competitors will excel at certain events due to their own individual physical advantages, and may not excel at others due to the same reason.

If a contest is well put together, the overall strongest man/woman will win in the end.

[Jay Hagadorn]

Jay, Arild Haugen is 1m90 ( 6'2" ) at 135 kg ( 297 lbs) in 2007. He competed at 2008 Fortissimus at some 310 lbs . And the same year came up with that fantastic run at the Stones at WSM.

What psyched him out was not height or mass but the poor pay that came out of Strongman !!!

Awe crud, I thought he was 5'10" or something like that...

[Jay Hagadorn]

Just because you're tall doesn't mean you're a stronger stone lifter. But when it comes down to two equally strong "stoners" the taller man has the advantage.

WOW!!!

Well I guess you should know this then:

Pudzianowski was out dead lifted by a much taller guy, and he was out pressed by a much taller guy. Aren't short guys supposed to have the advantage there?
:B:

[LouFatski]

WOW!!!

Well I guess you should know this then:

Pudzianowski was out dead lifted by a much taller guy, and he was out pressed by a much taller guy. Aren't short guys supposed to have the advantage there?
:B:


Pudz was "out dead lifted" by a man nearly 100 pounds heavier.

[Scott Markowitz]

Pudz was "out dead lifted" by a man nearly 100 pounds heavier.

Why the quotes? Was it not really a deadlift? Did Z not really win? :confused:

[LouFatski]

Why the quotes? Was it not really a deadlift? Did Z not really win? :confused:

Because there's no such word as out dead lifted. Of course he won. Z is the man and he's a class act.

[Mike Landrich]

Because there's no such word as out dead lifted.

You're right. It's actually 3 words.:M:

Seriously though. Calm down, take a few deep breaths and relax. Everything you comment on comes back to "Marius is shorter, lighter and in better shape. He would've won all else being equal". That's what makes Strongman such a great sport. Although there are "light" and "heavy" shows, ultimately it all comes down to numbers. Its performance based and you win by weight, times and reps, not by a judge's whim, although Glenn Ross might argue that from 2003 or whenever the log medley cost him.

[Paul E Ohl]

Mike, AMEN.

[LouFatski]

You're right. It's actually 3 words.:M:

Seriously though. Calm down, take a few deep breaths and relax. Everything you comment on comes back to "Marius is shorter, lighter and in better shape. He would've won all else being equal". That's what makes Strongman such a great sport. Although there are "light" and "heavy" shows, ultimately it all comes down to numbers. Its performance based and you win by weight, times and reps, not by a judge's whim, although Glenn Ross might argue that from 2003 or whenever the log medley cost him.

The trouble is the man doesn't seem to get a whole lot of respect around here.

[Steve Dohoney]

The trouble is the man doesn't seem to get a whole lot of respect around here.

He'll be fine man, trust me.

[Mike Landrich]

The trouble is the man doesn't seem to get a whole lot of respect around here.


He gets respect as a Strongman and for what he has done. The problem is when some of his fans start using physique and bodyfat comparisons rather than performance numbers to justify their adoration. He doesn't need it. He has enough going for him strength-wise. The physique should be for the ladies, the numbers for the male fans.


I personally respect him more for his #2 this year than for many of his wins, due to the caliber of competition.

[LouFatski]

He gets respect as a Strongman and for what he has done. The problem is when some of his fans start using physique and bodyfat comparisons rather than performance numbers to justify their adoration. He doesn't need it. He has enough going for him strength-wise. The physique should be for the ladies, the numbers for the male fans.

I personally respect him more for his #2 this year than for many of his wins, due to the caliber of competition.

His physique speaks for itself, and so do his numbers, and so do his WSM titles.

[LouFatski]

He'll be fine man, trust me.

Of course he'll be fine. And he will be back next year, trust me.

[Kevin Cronin]

I'll say this. I have a TON more respect for Mariusz after 08 and 09 than I did in 05-07. The man just finds a way to win (in 08) or at the very make himself THE #1 threat (as this year). He's a competitor. In a way, I believe that Mariusz was cheated, similarly if not the same way Zydrunas was. Had the IFSA split never occurred, we woudl have witnessed (I now believe) epic, titanic struggles for the last four years, much the same way that strength sports were cheated out of a chance to witness JPS vs Kaz in his prime through similar political BS

I'm really, truly glad that Zydrunas got his rightful title, finally, but I am almost as glad that we got a chance to witness Zydrunas vs Mariusz (at least) one more time.

[Paul E Ohl]

Kevin, it was about time that this came up.

That's exactly it. Well said.

[Mike Landrich]

His physique speaks for itself, and so do his numbers, and so do his WSM titles.


That's exactly what I meant when I said his fans justify their adoration. :disgust:

On a Strongman site, only the performances speak for themselves. The WSM titles are part of the performances.

[Jonathan Macfarlane]

http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w4/Shroedinger/Thread%20Pics/thread_wont_die.jpg

[LouFatski]

That's exactly what I meant when I said his fans justify their adoration. :disgust:

On a Strongman site, only the performances speak for themselves. The WSM titles are part of the performances.

If it speaks for itself it's needless to say. Besides, wasn't he the smallest guy there?

[Mike Landrich]

If it speaks for itself it's needless to say. Besides, wasn't he the smallest guy there?


Apparently it doesn't speak for itself. Why would it. it has you?


To answer your question, NO he wasn't. Even if he was, what would it prove? NOTHING.

[LouFatski]

Apparently it doesn't speak for itself. Why would it. it has you?


To answer your question, NO he wasn't. Even if he was, what would it prove? NOTHING.

It has you what? I don't know where you're going with this.

Shahlaei and LPJ weighed less than 295?

[Tyler Shelgren]

didnt Terry and M-Dub Say that they were told by mariusz himself that he weighed in at around 320lbs, I mean I could be wrong, oh wait i am not. :EL:

[Mike Landrich]

It has you what? I don't know where you're going with this.


It doesn't have to speak for itself. You are speaking enough for it

[Paul E Ohl]

Lou, if you want your mind to be set at rest with all this, ask the WSM organizers to send you the official weigh in list of the athletes.

And, as far as LPJ, he left Canada on the evening of September 22 at 314 lbs.

[Matt Schumann]

I like how the debate has shifted from the actual results to what the exact bodyweight was of each athlete.

After reading this entire thread I have come up with 2 conclusions.

1-Savickas won the title this year but mariusz definitely had tHe best looking abs.

And

2- if sadler had gained 150lbs of pure muscle for this years wsm he would have definitely won.

[LouFatski]

Lou, if you want your mind to be set at rest with all this, ask the WSM organizers to send you the official weigh in list of the athletes.

And, as far as LPJ, he left Canada on the evening of September 22 at 314 lbs.

My mind is at rest but I'm not sure about Mr. Landrich.

No doubt in the interview Pudz said he was the lightest at 133 and Z the heaviest at 176. That's easily 90 lbs. difference. I believe Z is also about 4 inches taller.

[Brandon Smith]

My mind is at rest but I'm not sure about Mr. Landrich.

No doubt in the interview Pudz said he was the lightest at 133 and Z the heaviest at 176. That's easily 90 lbs. difference. I believe Z is also about 4 inches taller.

Yes, Mariusz was the lightest competitor in the finals as verified by Laurence Shahlaei (aka Loz!):

"I was the 2nd lightest guy in the final, only marius was ligter, so i know i need to clean up my diet and put some muscle on and loose some fat."

http://www.marunde-muscle.com/forum/showthread.php?p=291370#post291370

There Lou, you're right. Does it feel good? Or make a difference in the results? Can we stop beating a dead horse already? Body weight and height are not everything in strongman. How many WSM have Glenn Ross (215kg) or Chief Iron Bear Collins (375-385lb when he competed) won?

It's about who is the best man on that particular day (or days in this case). Zydrunas brought it and won. Mariusz also pushed him until the end but lost. Same thing happened last year with Derek and Mariusz and Mariusz won. When you had the most stacked field at WSM in a long time, anyone could have had a breakout performance and taken home the win.

So can we congratulate all the guys who made it a great contest, give props to Big Z for winning, and move on for the love of God? If you want, we can discuss the actual contest and weights and events and you can go stare at pictures of Mariusz's chiseled abs....:BB:

[Kevin Cronin]

I can't wait to relive this entire conversation when the contest gets broadcast at christmas :D

[Patrick McGuffin]

Relive? At this rate it will still be going...

[Jonathan Macfarlane]

All the intelligent things that can be said in this thread have been said...


HIJACK


http://www.snurk.com/files/images/pic_unrelated.preview.jpg

http://ninxmz.org/images/demotivators/creepy%20threads.jpg

http://www.productwiki.com/upload/images/demotivators-400-400.jpg

[LouFatski]

Yes, Mariusz was the lightest competitor in the finals as verified by Laurence Shahlaei (aka Loz!):

"I was the 2nd lightest guy in the final, only marius was ligter, so i know i need to clean up my diet and put some muscle on and loose some fat."

http://www.marunde-muscle.com/forum/showthread.php?p=291370#post291370

There Lou, you're right. Does it feel good? Or make a difference in the results? Can we stop beating a dead horse already? Body weight and height are not everything in strongman. How many WSM have Glenn Ross (215kg) or Chief Iron Bear Collins (375-385lb when he competed) won?

It's about who is the best man on that particular day (or days in this case). Zydrunas brought it and won. Mariusz also pushed him until the end but lost. Same thing happened last year with Derek and Mariusz and Mariusz won. When you had the most stacked field at WSM in a long time, anyone could have had a breakout performance and taken home the win.

So can we congratulate all the guys who made it a great contest, give props to Big Z for winning, and move on for the love of God? If you want, we can discuss the actual contest and weights and events and you can go stare at pictures of Mariusz's chiseled abs....:BB:

I’m just stating facts and I’m not beating any horse. In the case of big Z the extra mass has helped him a lot over the last few years and right now he is the man to beat.

Let’s not forget the name of this website… “marunde-muscle” not “marunde-fat”

[Patrick McGuffin]

Your argument for the past ten pages has been that mariusz is cooler because he has abs.....


Oh and Jono, pandas cant spew rainbows from their mouths. Everyone knows they are to sad for rainbow fighting.

[Paul E Ohl]

Thank you Brandon for a crisp and clear post.

We should all say now: Thanks for everything ! Congrats to the competitors for their huge and valued efforts !

Back to the gym and see you all next year God willing and Inch Allah !!!

[LouFatski]

Your argument for the past ten pages has been that mariusz is cooler because he has abs.....


I never said that.

[Jonathan Macfarlane]

http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t314/gobblerhitman/BeatDeadHorse.gif

[Patrick McGuffin]

That poor poor horse... TO THE GLUE FACTORY! Or maybe make horse tacky?

[Mike Landrich]

My mind is at rest but I'm not sure about Mr. Landrich.


I can assure you my mind is at rest. I don't have to defend my man-crush...

Here's how I feel about the contest. Its really simple. The strongest man at that comp won.


As for lightest, wasn't Darren Sadler lighter than either Loz or Pudz?


On another note, Lou, how do you feel about Riku Kiri?

[RyanWilson]

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/5612/fuknomx9.gif

'Nuff said.

[Craig Pfisterer]

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a41/bmoviebuff/crank209.jpg?t=1255566845

[LouFatski]

I can assure you my mind is at rest. I don't have to defend my man-crush...

Here's how I feel about the contest. Its really simple. The strongest man at that comp won.


As for lightest, wasn't Darren Sadler lighter than either Loz or Pudz?


On another note, Lou, how do you feel about Riku Kiri?

I'd have to say my favorite strongmen since I started watching in the 70's are Pudz and Z... Z for his mass and gentle overwhelming strength and Pudz for his explosive power, domination, passion and intensity. I also like Terry, Dymek, and Bergmanis. It will be a while before a strongman emerges to consistently dominate like Pudz or Z. Riku Kiru finished on the podium several times in WSM so I have high respect for him. Robert Szczepanski beat Marius recently in Poland so I'm wondering if he will be a threat next year. Of the Americans I like Poundie and Ostlund, but I don't believe we'll see a dominant American in the near future.

[Jay Hagadorn]

This thread started out so good...then it got real bad...now I find it entertaining! Lou, you have set a Marunde-Muscle record for the most red dots on reputation without getting banned. You go boy, set the bar high!:BB:

[LouFatski]

I can assure you my mind is at rest. I don't have to defend my man-crush...

Here's how I feel about the contest. Its really simple. The strongest man at that comp won.


As for lightest, wasn't Darren Sadler lighter than either Loz or Pudz?


On another note, Lou, how do you feel about Riku Kiri?

repeat - delete

[LouFatski]

This thread started out so good...then it got real bad...now I find it entertaining! Lou, you have set a Marunde-Muscle record for the most red dots on reputation without getting banned. You go boy, set the bar high!:BB:

I guess I'm learning.

[John Evans]

Yes, Mariusz was the lightest competitor in the finals as verified by Laurence Shahlaei (aka Loz!):

"I was the 2nd lightest guy in the final, only marius was ligter, so i know i need to clean up my diet and put some muscle on and loose some fat."

http://www.marunde-muscle.com/forum/showthread.php?p=291370#post291370

There Lou, you're right. Does it feel good? Or make a difference in the results? Can we stop beating a dead horse already? Body weight and height are not everything in strongman. How many WSM have Glenn Ross (215kg) or Chief Iron Bear Collins (375-385lb when he competed) won?

I know height, weight or what the body looks like are not strongman, but Mariusz being the lightest, but looking the biggest in terms of muscle mass and ripped, makes him the best in my eyes.

It's about who is the best man on that particular day (or days in this case). Zydrunas brought it and won. Mariusz also pushed him until the end but lost. Same thing happened last year with Derek and Mariusz and Mariusz won. When you had the most stacked field at WSM in a long time, anyone could have had a breakout performance and taken home the win.

Well said.

All are top class strongmen, but the greatest to date for me are Mariusz and Big Z in that order

So can we congratulate all the guys who made it a great contest, give props to Big Z for winning, and move on for the love of God? If you want, we can discuss the actual contest and weights and events and you can go stare at pictures of Mariusz's chiseled abs....:BB:

For me the best event was Mariusz and Derek doing the axle lift. But as yet I have not seen the famers walk with Mariusz, anyone got it ?????

[John Evans]

Lou, if Z's platforms would have been 2" higher what would have Mariusz done ?

Height is NOT a definite factor in that sport, I must disagree.

What the taller athletes gain in leverage at some events they lose in others, ie in the Overhead for one.

Phil Pfister was the last strength athlete of over 6'4" to have won a WSM contest.

Please consider Ahola, Taylor, Svend, and of course Mariusz. They did not bother about height and size for that matter.

When taking of this year’s stones, I can now see Mariusz did slightly jump the whistle, but not by 2 seconds, more like half a second. The 100m runners practice this, and at times are a little fast, thus Mariusz will have practised this, and this time was ever to slightly half a second fast.
However if people think that height was not an issue in the stones, lets exaggerate this, Big Z was 7 foot, and Mariusz 4 foot ????? But that’s an excuse.

Talking of excuses, what if Mariusz was slightly faster in the truck pull, as there were 6 at times in-between one second ????? What if Mariusz waited 2 seconds more in the axle, he would have draw with Big Z in his best event ????? What if Mariusz was slightly faster in the FF and beat Derek ????? What if there was the stone carry for distance instead of the FF ????? What if Mariusz had not torn his biceps and had far more time to train ????? I mean what he done in three months, not even Arny could make a comeback like that, it was a comeback that would/should be in a Rocky movie, but it was in real life, wow that stands out as one of the most remarkable things in Strongman for me.

Please do not take too much of the what ifs above, just being a bit tongue in cheek, that is except the last one.

[Tyler Shelgren]

But he wasn't and he lost Big Z won, and that is the end of the story. someone lock this thread please :BB:

[John Evans]

But he wasn't and he lost Big Z won, and that is the end of the story. someone lock this thread please :BB:

As I said, please don’t take the what ifs that serious, as I could easy say them about Derek or Brian or anyone, its just a bit of fun, as deep down every one knows Mariusz is the greatest ROL, thats a little joke also, however I think its true.

[Patrick McGuffin]

I think pepperoni pizza is the greatest pizza of all time because lots of people order it. Not that crappy supreme or combination pizza.

[Scott Markowitz]

I think pepperoni pizza is the greatest pizza of all time because lots of people order it. Not that crappy supreme or combination pizza.

Maybe, but true pizza fans (meaning those who actually eat pizza themselves, not just the casual fans who watch pizza on tv) know that meat lovers' is the best and has shown this many times over the last several years. Pepperoni keeps ducking meat lovers. (Hmm...I wonder if anyone has ever put duck on a pizza? I bet it'd be good on a pizza w/ white sauce.)

[Patrick McGuffin]

Meat lovers is to fatty and gives eaters indigestion. It could never stack up to pepperonis ability top be eaten in gratuitous quantities!

[Patrick McGuffin]

Besides, pepperoni is the one that wins everyone to who watches pizza, they haven't hardly even heard of meat lovers. How can meat lovers be the best if no one knows it?

[Scott Markowitz]

Pepperoni gets all the press because of the way it looks, and kids and the simple-minded love it, but anyone who is serious about pizza knows that meat lovers is the way to go. More meat = better pizza.

[Alex Klotz]

Pepperoni has won the Best Pizza Competition like 5 times, but that's because the rules are suited for pepperoni and meat lovers never competes in it. Pizzisimus is where the real challenge is.

[Scott Markowitz]

I'm not sure how the idea came about that meat lovers' is slow. Even though a fully loaded meat pizza weighs 1.5-2 times as much as a mere pepperoni, they can be eaten in the same amount of time. And for indigestion? Please...if you can't handle the meat, stay away from the pie!

[Mike Landrich]

I'm not sure how the idea came about that meat lovers' is slow. Even though a fully loaded meat pizza weighs 1.5-2 times as much as a mere pepperoni, they can be eaten in the same amount of time. And for indigestion? Please...if you can't handle the meat, stay away from the pie!

You guys need more veggies. ALong with pepperoni and sausage, you should get hot peppers, green peppers, onions and mushrooms. Keep the diet well-balanced

[Scott Markowitz]

As long as there are roughly the same amount of toppings on one side as there are on the other, it's balanced.

[Paul E Ohl]

So what we are all saying is that Zydrunas Savickas is definitely on the very short list of candidates for The Strongest Man Who Ever Lived, but that he is certainly, at present, The Strongest Man Alive on Earth.

[Jonathan Macfarlane]

So what we are all saying is that Zydrunas Savickas is definitely on the very short list of candidates for The Strongest Man Who Ever Lived, but that he is certainly, at present, The Strongest Man Alive on Earth.

I agree.

+1 Meatlovers.

[Patrick McGuffin]

NO!NO!NO! You have it all wrong Scott! Meat lovers cant possibly be better than pepperoni! Pepperoni packs in WAY more flavor than meat lovers. It takes meat lovers an extra half pound of toppings just to be able to compete with the amount of flavor that a few slim pieces of pepperoni can do. WHAT IF pepperoni were to bulk up to the size of a meat lovers? HUH?! That's right, meat lovers wouldn't have a chance.

[Craig Pfisterer]

Sure they are both good pizzas and it came down to the last event but the clear winner is meatlover's.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a41/bmoviebuff/Other%20Stuff/worldsstrongestpizza.jpg

[John Evans]

So what we are all saying is that Zydrunas Savickas is definitely on the very short list of candidates for The Strongest Man Who Ever Lived, but that he is certainly, at present, The Strongest Man Alive on Earth.

Not sure why anybody would think the old time Strongmen, or the new time Strongmen from the start of the WSM are anywhere near the strength of the modern time strongmen of today, like the top two, Big Z and Mariusz.

Just take the top two times in this years 800kg boat pull,

Brian 32 seconds.
Mariusz 36 seconds

Top two times for 1999 600kg boat pull,

M. Samuelsson 31.62
H. Girard 32.27.

Please note the boat was 200kg heaver for this years WSM.

[Chris Weaver]

I don't know why no one is has considered plain cheese. Sure, the other toppings might be bigger and heavier, but cheese is so much more versatile. Who doesn't like cheese? Even vegetarians can enjoy cheese. Where as two big slices of meat fills you up and makes you slow, four slices of cheese hits the spot just right.

+1 for cheese and 2 a liter of pepsi, if you disagree then you are wrong.

[Mike Landrich]

Not sure why anybody would think the old time Strongmen, or the new time Strongmen from the start of the WSM are anywhere near the strength of the modern time strongmen of today, like the top two, Big Z and Mariusz.

Just take the top two times in this years 800kg boat pull,

Brian 32 seconds.
Mariusz 36 seconds

Top two times for 1999 600kg boat pull,

M. Samuelsson 31.62
H. Girard 32.27.

Please note the boat was 200kg heaver for this years WSM.

Was everything else the same? Angle of the ramp, distance, etc?

[Mike Landrich]

Even vegetarians can enjoy cheese. .

Vegans eat no animal products, so cheese is out. They like sauce pies, maybe a little tofu.:disgust:

[John Evans]

Was everything else the same? Angle of the ramp, distance, etc?

Angle was the same, but not sure of disstance.

[Scott Markowitz]

If pepperoni bulked up to the size of meat lovers', it would lose the only advantage it has at the moment - that it's faster to prepare. If you had to spend all that extra time adding more and more slices to the pie, it might gain some of the filling aspects of a meat lovers' but it would take so long to put together (not to mention the grease!) that it might never win another contest.

As for cheese...please, we're talking pro-level pizzas here. Leave the amateurs out of this.

[Chris Weaver]

As for cheese...please, we're talking pro-level pizzas here. Leave the amateurs out of this.

Everyone said that about the cheese pizza back in '97 and '99...and look what happened. It's not the size of the pie that matters, its the quality that counts.

[RyanWilson]

Vegans eat no animal products, so cheese is out. They like sauce pies, maybe a little tofu.:disgust:

Hey, we've got our own vegan cheese! Makes a mighty fine pizza, if you ask me ;)

http://www.daiyafoods.com/images/mixed_shred_small.jpg (http://www.nexternal.com/vegane/Product2767)

We've come a long way, baby! :D

[Paul E Ohl]

John Evans, I can think of a few events where old time Strongman, and I mean old time ,remain unbeaten.

As an example, Louis Cyr's one arm dumbbell press of 273 1/4 lbs. Add his 4337 lbs back lift.

Then consider some of Paul Anderson's lifts.

And, of course, the entire track record of Kaz, including his PL world records.

Good reference with Samuelsson and Hugo Girard, but we are not on the top of the list, although Hugo had a pretty amazing track record with his log and farmer's records back in 2003.

[Patrick McGuffin]

If pepperoni bulked up to the size of meat lovers', it would lose the only advantage it has at the moment - that it's faster to prepare. If you had to spend all that extra time adding more and more slices to the pie, it might gain some of the filling aspects of a meat lovers' but it would take so long to put together (not to mention the grease!) that it might never win another contest.

As for cheese...please, we're talking pro-level pizzas here. Leave the amateurs out of this.

Why do you think it doesn't huh? as it is meat lovers is so heavy that the slices droop and fold under their own weight! You cant even take a bite without lifting the whole slice 6" above where your mouth is and then you just end up chasing the point like someone with brain damage trying to put a spoon in their mouth. Meat lovers might have one this one contest but pepperoni will always be the best in the world. It has nothing to prove. You are wrong.

[Mike Landrich]

Why do you think it doesn't huh? as it is meat lovers is so heavy that the slices droop and fold under their own weight! You cant even take a bite without lifting the whole slice 6" above where your mouth is and then you just end up chasing the point like someone with brain damage trying to put a spoon in their mouth. Meat lovers might have one this one contest but pepperoni will always be the best in the world. It has nothing to prove. You are wrong.


So, you're saying pepperoni pizza is best *

[Patrick McGuffin]

Yes, but I do not think it needs an * at the end. Just a period.

[Craig Pfisterer]

Yes, but I do not think it needs an * at the end. Just a period.I'd agree with you if tests had not shown that Pepperoni had stuffed crust in 2004.

[Patrick McGuffin]

Oh really? Have you seen those tests? Pepperoni was set up.

[Craig Pfisterer]

Oh really? Have you seen those tests?Yes and they were delicious. Pepperoni got caught red-handed with extra cheese and extra cheese costs extra! Heck this probably the reason we had the Pizza Hut/Dominoes split.

[Patrick McGuffin]

It was political. Dominoes needed some sort of reason to justify the split, not only that but you know they created events that suited the heavier, beefier Meat Lovers pizza!

[Mike Landrich]

It was political. Dominoes needed some sort of reason to justify the split, not only that but you know they created events that suited the heavier, beefier Meat Lovers pizza!

But cheese stayed with the original chain and looks so good, it must be better

[Craig Pfisterer]

It was political. Dominoes needed some sort of reason to justify the split, not only that but you know they created events that suited the heavier, beefier Meat Lovers pizza!So what if they had deeper dishes for the pizza's, it's world's best pizza not world's best wafer thin, edible plate.

[Patrick McGuffin]

Dont even get me started on the deep dish vs thin crust debate. We all know that deep dish pizza has gotten way out of hand over the past few years, so much so that there are now thin crust only federations. Its ridiculous.

[Patrick McGuffin]

Plus how can you call out pepperoni for a stuffed crust in '04 but you are fine with deep dish? What kind of bs is that?

[Scott Markowitz]

Deep dish is perfectly within the rules of regular pizza - it is just bigger. Stuffed crust is cheating. If you can't pile your cheese on the regular way, then...well, it's just not a real pizza.

[Chris Weaver]

But how can you expect the smaller pizzas (cheese, vegtable, mushroom) to be able to compete against the big boys unless they use some crust stuffing? Small pizzas just weren't designed to hold that sorta weight naturally.

Why not just stuff the crust of the meat lovers and have a truly dominating force?

[Easton Taylor]

Wow 25 pages? Ha! Here is my 2 cents. Big Z has never wavered and has competed in all the major championships. He has won all the major championships now. His WR records, winning percentage, and championships speak for themselves. He has never sherked a heavy show and 9 times out of ten wins them.

That cannot be said about Mariusz. He has won a single show 5 times (It just happens to be called "The World's Strongest Man". However he he is one of the greatest. The thing I can't stand about him is ........ He has been rocked at the Arnold, and ducked out of Fortimussimus. I want to see him step up to a more static show like before mentioned. Even in a comp suited for him, he still lost. Z showed up and beat him. You can claim bicep, but only Mariusz knows.

[Easton Taylor]

Oh an Meat lovers for the win!