Powerlifting changing it's format

[Matt Meinrod]

Do you guys think we'll ever see a day when Powerlifting gets rid of the bench press in favor of the Push Press, Behind Neck Jerk, or strict press...all from the rack of course.

I myself am a pretty good bencher (although I don't train it now that I'm done with college football), but it is THEY lift that shy's me away from the sport of powerlifting or even doing a push/pull meet.

[Joe Holland]

nope don't see any changes any time soon. too much money invested in sponsors for bench shirts and stuff. not that it is a bad thing or anything.

[Matt Meinrod]

Yeah that's true, I didn't think about the bench shirt companies would bitch and complain if the format was changed. It's a shame though because I know the majority of athletes would rather ditch the BP in favor of OHP.

[Josh Kamins]

Why would they change it though? The OHP or push presses are weightlifting based, not powerlifting. Its been this way forever, and I see no reason that it shouldn't be.

[Jay Hagadorn]

Do you guys think we'll ever see a day when Powerlifting gets rid of the bench press in favor of the Push Press, Behind Neck Jerk, or strict press...all from the rack of course.

I myself am a pretty good bencher (although I don't train it now that I'm done with college football), but it is THEY lift that shy's me away from the sport of powerlifting or even doing a push/pull meet.

Matt-

According to my research, the bench developed out of two of those lifts when powerlifting was first being organized...

[Joe Holland]

ummm... have to disagree. most guys love bench. imagine going from a 700 lb bench with a 2,500 total to a 350 OHP and a 2250 total.

[Matt Meinrod]

Most guys love bench, but I don't know anyone who loves a torn pec. or shoulder problems related to Benching. The only people I know who like bench press are high schoolers, frat guys, football scouts (225), and maybe powerlifters who have abnormally high bench numbers.

[Garrick Daft]

Matt, how many times could you bench 225?

[Matt Meinrod]

I did 40 in training about 4 months ago...did 33 at my Pro Day back in March...it was a combination of peaking too soon and only training upper body while taking time off from my dislocated ankle. As soon as I got my explosiveness back I lessoned my benching frequency.

[davebeers]

Most guys love bench, but I don't know anyone who loves a torn pec. or shoulder problems related to Benching. The only people I know who like bench press are high schoolers, frat guys, football scouts (225), and maybe powerlifters who have abnormally high bench numbers.
dude...i don't know who you hang out with but to me it seems as if the whole world is obsessed with benching.
We have 5 flat benches in our gym and its almost impossible to find a free one on a monday or tuesday. However, there's only 2 or 3 guys i've ever seen at my gym doing standing overhead presses.
Anytime i tell someone i'm a powerlifter 99% of the time they ask me how much i bench.


Also, bench shirts have prevented many pec tears and shoulder problems. Most of these injuries could be prevented anyway with changes in technique and/or adherence to periodic periods of rest/rehab

[Pete Berg]

The bench press is a main stay in powerlifting. I could see them dropping the DL or squat before dropping the bench. If you look at the comps now you see a lot of bench comps or push pull but you never see a squat comp or a DL comp. I don't care much for the bench but its there and I don't think it will go a way. :BP:

[Matt Meinrod]

dude...i don't know who you hang out with but to me it seems as if the whole world is obsessed with benching.
We have 5 flat benches in our gym and its almost impossible to find a free one on a monday or tuesday. However, there's only 2 or 3 guys i've ever seen at my gym doing standing overhead presses.
Anytime i tell someone i'm a powerlifter 99% of the time they ask me how much i bench.


Also, bench shirts have prevented many pec tears and shoulder problems. Most of these injuries could be prevented anyway with changes in technique and/or adherence to periodic periods of rest/rehab

Again like I said, the only people benching are the kinds of people I listed above.

[AaRoNSnider]

How many times have we all heard"how much do you bench??" .I think if you took a poll from the general public,most people would say that they are more interested in seeing or having a big bench,than any other lift.I think that reason alone is enough of a reason for powerlifting promotors to always have the bench press in their competitions.I hope that more promotors start having raw meets.Im not a huge fan of the bench press,but am impressed by the raw numbers being put up.I think that more raw meets would make alot of us have more respect for the bench press.

[Josh Kamins]

Plus, I wouldn't say that overhead pressing can't cause shoulder problems also..

[Matt Meinrod]

How many times have we all heard"how much do you bench??" .I think if you took a poll from the general public,most people would say that they are more interested in seeing or having a big bench,than any other lift.I think that reason alone is enough of a reason for powerlifting promotors to always have the bench press in their competitions.I hope that more promotors start having raw meets.Im not a huge fan of the bench press,but am impressed by the raw numbers being put up.I think that more raw meets would make alot of us have more respect for the bench press.

haha, but since when does the general public give a rats ass about Powerlifting? I don't think powerlifters give a damn about the lift, but they perform it because it's a must. Bench Press is more of a macho lift for guys in their teens and twenties than anything else.

[Kevin McNease]

Ive never met a hardcore/dedicated powerlifter that doesnt like the bench...except me. Its here to stay forever. The bench press in powerlifting is an art form. The people that are best at it, practice the shit out of it. Its more than just being strong.

[DaneGarreau]

Unfortunatly the bench is here to stay.

But IMO, the strict press would be a much better test of functional upper body strength.

[doug Carroll]

As a former powerlifter, started in 82', I can say bench shirts are about big numbers, period. When is the last time you saw a lifter wearing a snug bench shirt for safety? I never have. The bench is the eaziest of the three, I mean come on, you get to lay down on a comfortable pad. Squats are hard, Deads are hard. No matter how hard you train the Bench it is not as hard as the other two. Ego is the other thing to consider, someone with little foundation and big desires can, with some practice in a matter of weeks handle far more weight in the bench then the overhead. I love the overhead stuff, but the the truth is the bench will always, with or with out shirts be more popular.

[Ben Booker]

I am not a fan of the lazy bench press and IMO is the most over rated test of strength, ever. Anyhow it is here to stay, like everyone said "So...what do you bench?" who gives a sh!t. A better question would be "So...how much you deadlift?", now that is a great messure of strength.

I would like to see Olympic lifting take powerlifting's place, but I know that would be wishful thinking. I do like the squat and DL though.

[Brandon Campbell]

I enver had any pec or shoulder problems, if ya bench right shouldnt hurt anything. Alot of people have injuries due to 1. using more weight then they should with bench shirts. and 2. not using good form and goin out of the natural ROM of the shoulder joint. OHP can hurt your shoulders just as much as a bench. If not more!

[Josh Kamins]

As a former powerlifter, started in 82', I can say bench shirts are about big numbers, period. When is the last time you saw a lifter wearing a snug bench shirt for safety? I never have. The bench is the eaziest of the three, I mean come on, you get to lay down on a comfortable pad. Squats are hard, Deads are hard. No matter how hard you train the Bench it is not as hard as the other two. Ego is the other thing to consider, someone with little foundation and big desires can, with some practice in a matter of weeks handle far more weight in the bench then the overhead. I love the overhead stuff, but the the truth is the bench will always, with or with out shirts be more popular.

I disagree, I think learning a bench shirt, stuffing yourself in and controlling the shirt is much 'harder' than deadlifting is. I prefer deadlifting, but shirted benching is more painful and more difficult to learn than deadlifting.

[davebeers]

haha, but since when does the general public give a rats ass about Powerlifting? I don't think powerlifters give a damn about the lift, but they perform it because it's a must. Bench Press is more of a macho lift for guys in their teens and twenties than anything else.
every powerlifting meet i have ever been in has had more benchers that squaters or deadlifters. With the addition of bench shirts more lifters are lifting into their 50's,60's, 70's without as many injuries.
I don't know what planet your living on but the bench is a mainstay on this place we call earth.

Strongman and poor benchers are the only 2 groups of people who i've found don't like the bench.

[Kevin Cronin]

Yeah that's true, I didn't think about the bench shirt companies would bitch and complain if the format was changed. It's a shame though because I know the majority of athletes would rather ditch the BP in favor of OHP.

I absolutely disagree with that. I think the bench is getting a bad rap here just because its such a popular lift amongst people who have no idea what theyre doing. It's a basic compound lift, neither more nor less important than any other upper body basic compound lift. I think overhead work is just as likely if not more likely to hurt your shoulders

Strongman and poor benchers are the only 2 groups of people who i've found don't like the bench :YT: haha, thats funny

:BP:

[Matt Meinrod]

- The question we've all heard "how much can you bench" is asked by non lifters, girls, old people that don't know much about strength training, and novices and gym rats at the local golds who are only there to get abs, chests, and biceps for the beach. Fact is, if Overhead press was popular back in the 60's and 70's and 80's, nobody would ask that dumb ass question "how much can you bench".

- Completely agree that bench shirts are all about ego. Otherwise people would just compete raw. That is if they arguement is true about OHP being more harmful to shoulders than benching (which I completely disagree with).

- I still believe that people would rather not have to do shirted bench press in a powerlifting meet if they had a choice.

[SqeezeMasterFlash]

I've always thought it would be fun to put on a contest for squat, deadlift, and clean and press, olympic style. J.V. Askem talks about how this was almost the format for powerlifting when it was under the control of the IWF.

For equipment, we'd go with the Joe Roark rule. If you can perform the lift in the equipment with just an empty bar, you can use it.

[JohnWietzel]

Fact is, if Overhead press was popular back in the 60's and 70's and 80's, nobody would ask that dumb ass question "how much can you bench".


I think the OHP was popular until it was removed from the olympics, that is when bench received a big boost in popularity. When my father was younger he said the question of the day was "How much you press?", so I think the OHP was quite popular in the 60's. Of course the people that were around in the 60's and lifting seriously are in their 60's now so many of us don't get much exposure to them at the training hall. Going back further, I believe the bench press and working your pecs in general was ridiculed and people laughed about building man-boobs.

Personally I find the bench press boring to perform. It feels damn good to get a new PR or to hit the groove just right, but I haven't really been excited about that lift (in a general sense) since I was 19 or 20. I've always enjoyed the OHP though, but that is likely just because I was taught how to lift by a man that had that as his favorite lift.

Regards,

John Jr.

[Jesse Snadden]

The bench shirt has nothing to do with ego.

How does powerlifting get money ? Inzer, titan and other gear companies sponsor them. In return, the federations are NOT allowed to host raw meets. So in order for a lifter to be competitive, he needs to suit up.
Don't hate the player, Hate the game

and raw bench press is an awesome exercise, it carries over to my overheads.

[Tony Moses]

When done correctly (something we take for granted, but something 95% of average gym-goers get wrong) the flat bench has a place as a compound upper body lift where a good amount of weight can be used to overload the upper body. No more, no less. The fact that you're laying down and things like arching and positioning and leg drive, and of course equipment can all play a role, make it less of a functional strength test than an OHP, in my opinion though.

As far as injuries, from what I have seen, most people press entirely too wide and often with flared elbows on ALL pressing exercises, which always was the reason I believed shoulder injuries are so common. For the competitive, equipped PL, it is reasonable to grip wide in a shirt, it shortens the ROM and the shirt protects the shoulders, but I think most people do press too wide and flare the elbows as a whole.

Personally, flat bench was always one of my better lifts, but I don't do them anymore, save for incline or close-grip work after overhead work, because I am not a powerlifter and basically have no reason to do them.....plus, I have no choice but to train at a commercial gym, and it is hit or miss whether you will get good hand-off guys or have the more typical 'spot-happy' douche bags to ruin your whole workout with their grab assing.

If someone could enlighten me, that would be great, I was always under the impression PL rose in popularity after '72 when the press was thrown out of OL, because traditionally and typically, the strong upper-body pressers were more or less your 'teddy bear' type lifters and had disproportionately strong presses and they could no longer compete with the best quick lifters in the world (generally a very fast, athletic, squat-powerful lifter).....I have heard that mentioned before and it made sense.....but if I am wrong, then I am wrong.

[Mac Smith]

[QUOTE=Jesse Snadden]...Don't hate the player, Hate the game

[QUOTE]


Didn't know yall Canadiens knew phrases like dat, Jess!!!! LOL!!!

Anyway, you put the overhead press into a powerlifting meet, I guarantee one of the equipment manufacturers will find a way to develop a shirt to push numbers up, therefore further watering down a already waterdowned sport!!!!

[B Campbell]

I only know one guy who can OHP near what he benches. But he's just an overhead pressing FREAK! 600lbs seated OHP is pretty impressive, but most people would rather bench in meets. It's all about the numbers, OHP would lessen their totals....How can I brag about big numbers if I have to do OHP? LOL.
There are a lot of powersports meets popping up lately. Maybe that's where the OHP should be making it's return! Perfect opportunity.

[SqeezeMasterFlash]

Anyway, you put the overhead press into a powerlifting meet, I guarantee one of the equipment manufacturers will find a way to develop a shirt to push numbers up, therefore further watering down a already waterdowned sport!!!!

Not if you make them clean it first! I don't think applying bench shirt technology for overhead lifts would allow you to get your arms in a position to make a solid clean.

[Kevin Cronin]

Not if you make them clean it first! I don't think applying bench shirt technology for overhead lifts would allow you to get your arms in a position to make a solid clean.

I would bet a lot of money that the manufacturers WOULD figure out a way ot make an overhead shirt.

Matt, where do you get the idea most people would rather bench without a shirt? I think when a lot of people say "yeah, I'd do a meet, except for having to learn all that gear" theyre really saying "i would do the meet, except that i would have ot commit to it, peak for it, and put myself out there in front of all those people" I dont say that as a bad thing, but I dont necessarily take what they say at face value

As far as everyone saying "well the overhead isnt included because then totals would go down" ... huh?!?! well, by that logic then the lifts should be squat (done to ipa standards), 4 board press, and 18" deadlift with straps. The organizers of powerlifting have the ability to inflate the totals all they want, they dont have to do it by keeping the overhead press out. In fact, if their only reason for keeping an exercise out is to keep the totals up, then why dont they switch in an overhead squat and a fat bar deadlift from a deficit. then the totals woudl really be in the crapper

[B Campbell]

Hey, powerlifting is powerlifting. Squat, bench, deadlift. You can't make baseball players use a football if you don't like baseball. Ok, that was dumb, but you get my point! I think it'd be great to do some other lifts in a contest, but it wouldn't be "powerlifting". Strongman is a great way to do odd lifts, and so is the powersports where they throw in curls. I'd love to do a meet with some of the tough lifts mentioned here. Let me know if anyone decides to go for it! Great debate on this too, by the way. Good points made.

[Patrick McGuffin]

I only know one guy who can OHP near what he benches. But he's just an overhead pressing FREAK! 600lbs seated OHP is pretty impressive, but most people would rather bench in meets. It's all about the numbers, OHP would lessen their totals....How can I brag about big numbers if I have to do OHP? LOL.
There are a lot of powersports meets popping up lately. Maybe that's where the OHP should be making it's return! Perfect opportunity.

I can oly style. Of course I dont bench much either so that kinda makes things lopsided a little.

[Bob Feeney]

IMO, bench isn't and shouldn't go anywhere. Being a former pl'er though, I can now let my ego say that the bp shirt (nowadays is more about numbers then protectio). Which is fine, to each his/her own. I had a 375 raw bp and got 535 out of my KK DD. that's a nice carry over, if you ask me. I probably could have done better, but fell in love in OL'ing. Now on to HG's,lol, but I can still train the olympic lifts and HG's at the same time. It's all explosiveness anyway

[Joe Holland]

can someone please tell me what HG stands for.... guess I'm outta the loop

[Bob Feeney]

HIGHLAND GAMES aka/ heavy athletics/aka heavy events

sorry

[Jesse Snadden]

I like the bench press :BP:

It's not my favorite exercise but it ranks up there. I used to hate it when I sucked at it, but once you figutre it out and your raw numbers kick up, it gets to be a lot of fun.

[Eddie Debus]

Yeah that's true, I didn't think about the bench shirt companies would bitch and complain if the format was changed. It's a shame though because I know the majority of athletes would rather ditch the BP in favor of OHP.

are you serious.... the majority of athletes would NOT rather ditch the BP for OHP.

PL has been squat/bench/dead since it started.....and that's how it will stay.
:BP:

[Joe Holland]

Eddie - I'm guessing you are the Eddie Debus who was at NERB. Great lifts man! I lift in the APF and am pretty young too. I think we lift in the same weight class - 242. How old are you? You're a Westside guy right?

[Eddie Debus]

Eddie - I'm guessing you are the Eddie Debus who was at NERB. Great lifts man! I lift in the APF and am pretty young too. I think we lift in the same weight class - 242. How old are you? You're a Westside guy right?

Thanks for the good words... I didn't have a great day at NERB but it was cool to lift with that caliber of lifters. I'm doing a 100% RAW meet in orlando with my training partner in august. Hopefully I'll be lifting better there and be injury free this time (knock on wood). My goals for that meet are 550/450/700 @220 ..... I'm dieting right now to get to 230lbs.

Im 18 and I'll be 19 at the end of july. I used to train straight westside but added much more volume and dropped my DE bench day. The only westside type day I have is my ME bench day but even that is questionable. I just use some boards and bands but basically no westside templates or anything.

My AIM sn is IronFreak242 if you wanna chat.

God Bless,
Eddie