best mix for making an atlas stone?

[Andrew Joakim]

Would would you say is the best mixture for making an atlas stone? Ive tried 3 parts sand 1 part portland, but I found it came out too smooth.

[Ryan Rhodes]

You'll just end up breaking a lot of stones with that mix. Use a fiber reinforced concrete. Q5000 works well.

[srojv]

Plain old quickcrete q5000 works fine you don't have to mix it with sand they come out smooth and strong.

[Steve Slater]

We have found Q5000 to be one of the best. I think the best and easiest is straight from the commercial concrete truck called a 4 bagger mix. It's cost may be a little more but it is mixed better and normally is stronger then Q5000. As far as being to smooth that can be a problem with the bottom but the top portion with the flat spot is normally a little more rough because of the air bubbles making it a better surface to lift from. When we made stones for Dr. Ken he wanted his stones textured (not wanting to use tacky) and wanting to be able to go from stones to barbells in a circuit. We experimented with a product that we can longer get from our suppliers that was called Top and Bond. Top and Bond worked very well and left a nice light sand texture that was durable. http://www.basalitedrymix.com/products/repair_topn.htm

We will soon be experimenting with Ultra Tuff Non-Skid rubberized coating
http://www.ultratuff.net/ this stuff should be very good if we can get it to adhere and handle punishment. It is a softer non skid surface. Worth a try!

[WILL NEWLAND]

Any idea wether we can get that stuff in England ?
If not what is the best homemade mix for stones ?
:EP:

[Paul Rykiert]

For extra fun fire in some lead wheel balancing weights into yer mix as aggregate! They can be had for a song at local tire shop. Depending on the amont of the lead weights you put in, you may experiance some setlling and so yer stones may be a wee bit off balance... but isn't that part of the fun? :M:

[WILL NEWLAND]

please.
Surely someone can spill the beans :marv:

[Paul Neuhaus]

Any idea wether we can get that stuff in England ?
If not what is the best homemade mix for stones ?
:EP:
If you're going to mix your own, just go to a local "home improvement" store and get the stuff that's in bags, preferrably a 5,000 psi mix (although you have the metric system). All you have to do is add water.

[WILL NEWLAND]

If you're going to mix your own, just go to a local "home improvement" store and get the stuff that's in bags, preferrably a 5,000 psi mix (although you have the metric system). All you have to do is add water
Thanks for that .
I`ve been using :
3 bags 10ml chippings
1 bag cement
2 shovels of sand
This make very smooth stones ,but i`m not sure how strong
this mix is ?
:F:

[Paul Neuhaus]

I think the best and easiest is straight from the commercial concrete truck called a 4 bagger mix. It's cost may be a little more but it is mixed better and normally is stronger then Q5000.
They call it a "4 bag mix" because it has 4 bags of cement per cubic yard.

IMO, this is the best way to go. The more yardage you order, the cheaper it will be "volume wise" because you still have to pay a delivery charge, and then so much per yard.

Here's the math.

1 yard of concrete weighs about 4,000 lbs.

Here's the price where I work, if you're not a contractor and don't have an account with us.
$95 per yard
$11.50 fuel surcharge
$70 minimum load charge (if you order less than 4 yards)

So, 1 yard would cost about $185 after tax. That's 4.6 cents per lb.
If you have enough friends who want stones, go ahead and get 2 yards at around $285 after tax. This comes out to about 3.5 cents per lb.

And, as Steve said, it will be mixed much better.

[SAM SOLOMI]

Thanks for that .
I`ve been using :
3 bags 10ml chippings
1 bag cement
2 shovels of sand
This make very smooth stones ,but i`m not sure how strong
this mix is ?
:F:

seemed good enough to me, no sign of damage to the stone when i put her down

[jon hergert]

They call it a "4 bag mix" because it has 4 bags of cement per cubic yard.

IMO, this is the best way to go. The more yardage you order, the cheaper it will be "volume wise" because you still have to pay a delivery charge, and then so much per yard.

Here's the math.

1 yard of concrete weighs about 4,000 lbs.

Here's the price where I work, if you're not a contractor and don't have an account with us.
$95 per yard
$11.50 fuel surcharge
$70 minimum load charge (if you order less than 4 yards)

So, 1 yard would cost about $185 after tax. That's 4.6 cents per lb.
If you have enough friends who want stones, go ahead and get 2 yards at around $285 after tax. This comes out to about 3.5 cents per lb.

And, as Steve said, it will be mixed much better.


I don't see how this would work out very well. 4 bag mix with 3/4" rock is less than 3000 psi strength, not going to be a very strong stone, quickrete 5000 is of course a 5000 psi mix and high tensile because of the fiber reinforcement. I don't know if you would outright crack one in half, but i would expect a lot of chips after even a short time of hard use.

Plus, even if you just get one yard, you are going to have enough concrete mix for a dozen stones, i don't know anyone short of Slater's hardware that has that many molds. Even if you did, it is going to take a couple of hours to pour that many, and the concrete trucks I work with only give you 4 minutes/yard of delivery time before standby charges kick in, after which standby is figured at $90/hr so you could add up another $180 of trucking expense real quick.

I think most folks would be better off just renting a small electric tub mixer and getting a pallet of quickrete 5000 so they can work on their own schedule.

[Paul Neuhaus]

I don't see how this would work out very well. 4 bag mix with 3/4" rock is less than 3000 psi strength, not going to be a very strong stone, quickrete 5000 is of course a 5000 psi mix and high tensile because of the fiber reinforcement. I don't know if you would outright crack one in half, but i would expect a lot of chips after even a short time of hard use.

Plus, even if you just get one yard, you are going to have enough concrete mix for a dozen stones, i don't know anyone short of Slater's hardware that has that many molds. Even if you did, it is going to take a couple of hours to pour that many, and the concrete trucks I work with only give you 4 minutes/yard of delivery time before standby charges kick in, after which standby is figured at $90/hr so you could add up another $180 of trucking expense real quick.

I think most folks would be better off just renting a small electric tub mixer and getting a pallet of quickrete 5000 so they can work on their own schedule.
No, my method would not work for everyone, I didn't say that.

The 4 bag mixes that are only 3000 psi are the footing and wall mixes. All of our flatwork concrete is at least 4000 psi. If you get a "straight cement" mix, it will be even stronger. Plus, you can add fibers for $7 per yard.

Our company does have the "overtime" fee, but we rarely ever charge for it. Sometimes 1 yard takes a while if they have to wheel it around back and go a long distance. They wouldn't charge extra unless it went well over an hour. Also, and I don't mean to sound arguementative or cocky, but I do know that I could pour 1 yard's worth of stones in less than 30 minutes.

Of course not everyone would have enough Slater moulds for a job like this. But, if you have enough friends in need of stones, and they're willing to make some plaster moulds, this method would be more cost efficient.

But, if you only need to make a handful of stones, the store-bought mix would be better.

[jon hergert]

Paul,

Funny how things are different across the US. Out here, if the concrete truck showed up and the contractor was planning on wheeling it into the backyard, the driver would either hand out the card of a concrete pumper and take off, or have the contractor sign an overtime statement there on the spot before the chute even dropped.

That overtime charge sticks hard in California, even for companies that buy a lot of concrete. Didn't want to see some poor guy order a concrete truck, take a couple of hours pouring stones, and then be stunned by his overtime bill.

ps, if you can really pour 1 yd of concrete into a dozen stone molds in 30 minutes and ever decide to relocate to the Central coast of California, look me up, i'll leave you with a standing offer of employment.

[Paul Neuhaus]

Funny how things are different across the US. Out here, if the concrete truck showed up and the contractor was planning on wheeling it into the backyard, the driver would either hand out the card of a concrete pumper and take off, or have the contractor sign an overtime statement there on the spot.

That overtime charge sticks hard in California, even for companies that buy a lot of concrete. Didn't want to see some poor guy order a concrete truck, take a couple of hours pouring stones, and then be stunned by his overtime bill.
HAHA That sounds about right! I grew up in Chicago, and they would probably do the same thing. In WI, a lot of businesses focus more on "building relationships" with contractors. I guess you could say it's a little more "country" here, if that makes sense.

[WILL NEWLAND]

Thanks for the advice gents but i live in the arse end of nowhere in
England.
I have no real local concrete firm & i only have 1 mould.
All i was after was a simple mix that i could make in a mixer .
Cheers .
:EL:

[Paul Neuhaus]

Paul,

Funny how things are different across the US. Out here, if the concrete truck showed up and the contractor was planning on wheeling it into the backyard, the driver would either hand out the card of a concrete pumper and take off, or have the contractor sign an overtime statement there on the spot before the chute even dropped.

That overtime charge sticks hard in California, even for companies that buy a lot of concrete. Didn't want to see some poor guy order a concrete truck, take a couple of hours pouring stones, and then be stunned by his overtime bill.

ps, if you can really pour 1 yd of concrete into a dozen stone molds in 30 minutes and ever decide to relocate to the Central coast of California, look me up, i'll leave you with a standing offer of employment.
Jon,

I was wrong about something. I checked with our batch man, and our 4 bag mixes are 3000 psi, but we don't sell any 4 bag mixes for flatwork. Here's a breakdown of what he told me.
4 bag = 3000 psi
5 bag = 3500 psi
6 bag = 4000 psi
.....and so on, all the way up to the dreaded 9 bag. (I hate hauling 9 bag)

So, my appologies for the mix up.

As for your offer, it is just WAAAAAY to hot for me in CA! HAHA Probably to the same extent that the WI winters would be too cold for you!